|
|
|
|
|
Indo-Pak: Time for third party mediation? Free Speech Host 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM Michael Kreppon argues that having waited too long to engage in proactive diplomacy in West Asia, the Bush administration risks repeating this mistake in South Asia. But it does not appear to have the horsepower or the focus to push for preventive measures. Eventually, Washington and New Delhi will have to find the wisdom to recognise the utility of outside help. What do you think? |
 |
| Messages |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 1 of 377 ) From Vinod Nair Rather than trying to fit yourself into pakistani shoes look at what will happen to the indigenious non muslim population of Kashmir once it becomes a part of Pakistan. The problem lies in the Pakistani state which was created by purifying itself of infidels. Those who survived the holocaust have been condemned to live as second class citizens. I support creating a separate homeland for the non muslim Kashmiris and pushing the rest out of india along with their land. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 2 of 377 ) From Parmesh Shah Anita Pratap's piece is a ranting of a arm chair writer with a very little understanding of the Kashmir issues. Pakistan twice in the past lost wars on Kashmir and agreed to talk bilaterally. The solution to this problem would come from a bold internal political move in India and not a mediator with Pakistan. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 3 of 377 ) From Arish K. Sahani Reading these articles only suggested that people like you are working for pakistan not India. I would have preferred if everyone has one Voice like Our USA president Bush . We want to elliminate terroism at any cost and before we talk to pakistan all indian should have one voice No more terroisum sponsored by Pakistan Period. We have been conquered beacause of people like you who see no point defending India . Poor your parents who gave you the birth you should have been born a muslim and faced the bombing of usa in afganistan to understand the islam . |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 4 of 377 ) From Dolly well i being an indian and seeing india and pakistan goiing through all this turmoil, strongly feel that the politiations should stop thinking about themselves and find a solution about kashmir problem. the differances are between the politicians not among the common public. why cant they ever follow the policy of live and let live!when culturally and resoursefully rich countries like india and pakisthan fight it is the third big country who'll take an adventage of it.and as for a third party mediation.... well no one will do it with a pure consious. they know if india and pakisthan are pally with each other they would prosper beyond the so called developed nations! |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 5 of 377 ) From Prasanna Parthasarathi Anita Pratap is reflective of the genuflecting pacifist ignoramuses that run the Indian Media.In her latest artcle"Bully,Know Thyself" she has very admirably painted India as an agressor which is somehow acting as a spoilt brat on the question of mediation.Add to that the tears she sheds for the poor quivering Pakistani's that are scared of war.She then gives full marks to Musharraf for banning the JeM and LeT which the arrogant Indians have not reciprocated.In between she manages to absolve the Pakistani establishment of its complicity with the ISI.WHEW!!! And what would the reality that half smart people like me witness.The streets of Pakistan are filled with people calling for death to India.Their newspapers are calling for Musharraf to nuke India.The jehadi's that we have not arrogantly acknowledged have been released after 15 days.To top it all Pakistani's claim that they are of Arab descent and are insulted when they are reminded of their common culture with India.This I know from experience here in the U.S. Regarding mediation,why do we need one?Ask Ms Pratap to look up Kasmir's Accession to India,the UNCIP resolutions asking for Pakistan to vacate POK,and the Shimla agreement.For her information,Pakistan has refused to honour this agreement which their rulers have signed.Now who is Arrogant??War is equally frightening for the Indians,especially the one's along the Border.Why is she not worried about them?Is their life any less valuable than the poor Pakstani's for whom she bleeds profusely?She ends her article(sic) with India's poverty.Does she realise that we are mired in Poverty because throughout the course of our history we have chosen butter over the Gun,;eaving the Invaders to loot our land. Please dont insult our intelligence by publishing these articles by pontificating losers.This is highly insulting to people like me who have lost loved ones in defense of our Country. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 6 of 377 ) From Jeff Goldman It is interesting to note that foreign press correspondents of Indian origin e.g. Anita Pratap (author of this story), Satinder Bindra, Rajeev Chandrasekharan (Washington Post), Ashok Sharma (AP) like to write, speak and dance to the tune of their editors or write against India in the name of `balanced reporting' rather than having sympathy or patriotism for their country. They seem to be odds with their own blood. I think by bashing India they want to win prizes or recognition or your own people, Indians, like to hear such stories. Look how all this contrasts with American journalists looking after American interests. After the News Editor of CNN circulated a note not to highlight civilian casualities in Afghanistan and the spokesperson of State Dept. expressed similar views, there were no stories on that issue. In 1999, I remember Satinder Bindra raving and ranting on CNN that Indian Government is not releasing Masood Azhar and other terrorists in exchange of passengers. He was presenting the story as if India was at fault and the terrorists were fighting for a noble cause. The same terrorists and their brethren created havoc on 9/11 and 12/13. Other journalists do not forget to write or report some phrases - Hindu dominated India, Muslim dominated Kashmir, Indian rule in Kashmir, nuclear rivals having fought three wars over Kashmir...... They never mention India is a secular country with more Muslims than in Pakistan. Kashmir not only has Muslims but also Buddhists, Hindus and Sikhs. India is a country where the Constitution grants special rights to Minorties to the extent of subsidizing trips to Saudi Arabia for devout Muslims. They never speak of kilings of thousands of innocent people in last 12 years..... Pakistan's same unsuccessful gameplan in Punjab to avenge the creation of Bangladesh. Kashmir is not just the Valley, it has Jammu and Ladakh as well. Pakistan has ceeded your country's (India) territory to China. Kashmir became a part of India because of the same Act passed by British Parliament which created not only Pakistan but also decided the fate of 600 kingdoms like Kashmir who joined either India or Pakistan. When all that was constitutionally valid then why not the accession of Kashmir to India??? I was surprised when none of your fellow journalists asked Tony Blair (who heads the same Parliament that created that Act) this question during his Indian trip when he said, Pakistan's position is strong in Kashmir. I think you guys need to read your own History first..... and teach it to Anita and her friends...... We Americans are not going come and teach your own History to you.... You need to take care of Anita, Satinder et al otherwise they will keep harming Indian interests. Good Luck |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 7 of 377 ) Raj Kumar Do you have any clue about politics and and history. Do some home work on history of kashmir then write. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 8 of 377 ) From Arif Pervaiz Wow, Anita Pratap (of the CNN fame, right?) can actually take an *objective* view of issues. Must have something to do with having left CNN. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 9 of 377 ) From Krishna For once just for once think from the angle of what indians Feel when the following events happen 1) 30 indians are killed daily in kashmir (forget them Lets talk accordoing to u) 2) When milintants attack parliament (ok forget it lets talk again 3) when we are attacked in parliament paki president says they are armed intruders and not terrorists and his spokesperson says this is a drama of the indians Why did u not remeber all the above but did remember what Jaswant singh had said and forget to mention in what context he said (let me remind u why he said that He said that as a reaction to paki foreign ministers claim that they are not able to trace the criminals when they live in luxury right under their noses) Is this selective amnesia or what? And then u spice up ur article with SUDDH Brahmin and temple constructing sants Well well nice touch to say the least SUDDH brahmin will create negative feelings in all non brahmins so use it to creat one among majority And all the sants are asking for constructing something And not killing infidels right??? Anyway what will a christian like u understand about india (small swipe from my side using ur technique of SHUDDH brahmin !!! nice ain't it) cheers |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 10 of 377 ) From Patriot Anita Pratap Does not know a dick about being an Indian. I request the OUTLOOK not published articles BY ANITA. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 11 of 377 ) From Leonard Anita Pratap: Shame on You!!!!! You Should become the "Fifth Wife" of Usama Bin Laden or Faz Ul Rehman. How can you write such "CRAP". Please Please, go and Live among the Taliban or live in Saudi Arabia !!!! They will love to have a "Shrike" living and publishing such garbage !!! Shame on you, "outlookIndia.com" Shame on You!!!!!! Leonard Coming from an minority Indian, you should really feel Ashamed |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 12 of 377 ) From Sandeep Shete Anita Pratap, in the garb of being a fair an balanced commentator, seems to virtually make common cause with the scheming, wily, double-crossing Pakistanis. India has been anything but a bully all these years. If anything, India has shown tremendous restraint in the face of extreme provocation from pakistan. She says, just the size of India on the map is intimidating for the average Pakistani. Well, for the last 2 decades, it has not intimidated him enough to desist from contributing generously to the Kashmiri Jehad donation rallies routinely conducted by the terrorist outfits on Pakistan's streets. These donations and the implied support from the ordinary Pakistani citizens actually embolden the terrorists to talk of hoisting the green flag atop the Red Fort. She says India rushed to the USA for mediation during the Kargil war. Maybe she has a short memory. India was very much capable of stamping out those Pakistan-backed intruders (who consisted of both army regulars and the hotheads) on its own then. The only reason we asked USA to prevail on Pakistan to back off from Kargil was that we did wish to cross the line of control (which again we were capable of doing and then we could have sorted out most of those training camps too at the same time). By involving USA, we in fact gave a face saving exit to Pakistan. Pakistan has no business feeling jealous of the plenty that is seen all around India. Pakistan too could have matched India's economic power had ordinary Pakistanis not been suckered into the "Islam in Danger", "Kashmir is Ours" bull**** dished out by the military-mullah combine. All said and done, ordinary Pakistanis are themselves responsible for the corner they feel they have been pushed into by India. As you sow, so shall you reap. Perhaps the likes of Ms. Pratap haven't heard of the above adage. Otherwise she wouldn't take up the issue of the self-inflicted emotional torture the average Pakistani experiences today. And to call India a bully only reminds me of those immortal lines: "Hum aah bharte hain to budnam ho jaate hain, Woh katl karte hain aur jikr bhi nahin hotaa." |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 13 of 377 ) From Siddhartha Singh It seems that the Arundhati Roy Bug has bitten Anita Pratap too! Writing controversial articles seems to be a shortest way to fame nowdays irrespective of whether the article has any meaning or not. Anita Pratap talks about double standards of India, well its good she woke up to reality now. However, wouldn't it be stupid for a country to adopt a single standard even though it might be harmful to its interests? After all, countries are not individuals. In fact India is perfectly justified as there is no interest at the national level except national interest and that should be taken care of by whatever means be it double standard or tripple standard or any other standard. Additionally, every other country does so. Her articles just repeats the same old events and adds nothing new (probably copy and paste job from news articles). Felt like I was listening to a kid who can think only in one dimension. For outlook, well done! You seem to thrive on controversy rather than quality content. Or is outlook just a magazine of opinions of every Tom, Dick and Harry? |
|
ntiwari 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 14 of 377 ) Ms. Pratap has written: "I am so glad I am not a Pakistani. If I was, my blood pressure would be shooting higher than the Hatf missiles. I would be a nervous wreck of frustration, fear and resentment. Forget you are an Indian for a moment and just see the play of recent events from the eyes of ordinary Pakistani citizens—not the Pakistani establishment—and you will see what I mean." In her drivel, Pratap argues that Musharraf's pathetic speech (remember, Kashmir runs in his blood) should be a good reason for India to de-escalate. But then, unlike her, I am unhappy that she is an Indian, for my blood pressure, after reading her silly little post, is shooting higher than an Agni missile. Here is Pratap arguing that based on a piddly little speech, India should de-escalate. I guess none of Pratap's blood relatives have died in the terrorist waves emanating from Pakistan, and which grip India. Pratap has worked for the US based CNN. Given this, I am surprised that she never understood that on matters of national interest, Americans (which run the CNN and were her paymasters) are absolutely uncompromising. For instance, they did not even discuss the possibility of 'negotiating' with the Taliban and Al-Qaeda. Did Pratap express her disgust at Americans then? And here is Pakistan, with whom we are willing to talk provided they honestly deliver on some basic things, like handing over the terrorists. |
|
ntiwari 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 15 of 377 ) Ms. Pratap has written: "I am so glad I am not a Pakistani. If I was, my blood pressure would be shooting higher than the Hatf missiles. I would be a nervous wreck of frustration, fear and resentment. Forget you are an Indian for a moment and just see the play of recent events from the eyes of ordinary Pakistani citizens—not the Pakistani establishment—and you will see what I mean." In her drivel, Pratap argues that Musharraf's pathetic speech (remember, Kashmir runs in his blood) should be a good reason for India to de-escalate. But then, unlike her, I am unhappy that she is an Indian, for my blood pressure, after reading her silly little post, is shooting higher than an Agni missile. Here is Pratap arguing that based on a piddly little speech, India should de-escalate. I guess none of Pratap's blood relatives have died in the terrorist waves emanating from Pakistan, and which grip India. Pratap has worked for the US based CNN. Given this, I am surprised that she never understood that on matters of national interest, Americans (which run the CNN and were her paymasters) are absolutely uncompromising. For instance, they did not even discuss the possibility of 'negotiating' with the Taliban and Al-Qaeda. Did Pratap express her disgust at Americans then? And here is Pakistan, with whom we are willing to talk provided they honestly deliver on some basic things, like handing over the terrorists. |
|
mohinder 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 16 of 377 ) Pakistan is an evil terrorist state which has only allah, mulla, lulla and burka. It has an industry of AK47's and heroin smugglng. No democracy, no dancing, no music, no debate. Only hate allah, mulla and burka. Clearly it is an evil enterprise. One fine day Aunty publicity..( arundhati roy and now anita pratap) may want to defend it. But bullshit. India should have nothing to do with it..... |
|
asif 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 17 of 377 ) It's sheer hypocrisy on part of us indians to first court Bush, Powell et al ; and then say we don't want their intervention. India [read Advani] insists that USA put pressure on Pakistan to stop terrorism in kashmir etc , and then say we don't want any third party intervention. We have spent more than 50 years in this sort of dilly-dallying and consequences are there for all to see. The solution to kashmir tangle has more to do with intent and actions of India and only small part with pakistan. Lets start a serious and rationale approach to the solution as old and rusted policies have failed to deliver. I think Ms Pratap has a point. |
|
awanish 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 18 of 377 ) The writer seems to be delibarately inflaming the blood pressure of a common indian like me , a malaise which she seems to be so terrified of. Her article does'nt offer any insight and struggles at surface of indo-pak relation and than she has temerity to say that how many indians know of Sir creek dispute. Madam,j ust because you came to know abt it yesterday, does'nt mean everyone is ignorant abt it. More over what double standard are you talking about. Nations dont have standards of behaviour, but only supreme interests and its interest determine its behaviour. If you dont know that than you are free to take refuge somewhere where you can preach ur standard as well as act on it. Pls take a hike to himalayas and refrain urself from writing on national matters. |
|
arhan23 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 19 of 377 ) i seriously doubt if Anita Pratap was born in India or Pakistan.At this hour of crisis she should use her intelect and wisdom for finding a solution to the nasty policy of cross-border terroism used by Pakistan against India instead of finding fault with Indian policy or exposing its past follies.While writing for a magazine she should keep in mind the national interest. arhan writwik |
|
suniths 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 20 of 377 ) Hey Asif why the hell are u siting at home. why dont u go to the border and have a look at what our soldiers are doing for u. maybe then u will realise who is being hypocrite. and u know what, if u still think India is a hypocrite why dont u pack ur bags and go to Pakistan |
|
saurabhs 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 21 of 377 ) Hi, It seems Ms Anita has lost sight of whats going around! She is suggesting bilateral talks with the people who have started it all! Why should Pakistanis have high blood pressure because of India? If theycant control their leaders or army generals should India pay for the same? She firmly belives in politics of convinience. When Musharaff came to power these were the people who were shouting from rooftops! Mr Musharraf is still a dictator not an elected head. Its is true we have not come up with a good policy about neighbours and world in general but still I would take Indian policy and principles any day when compared to Pakistan. I was diappointed to see no good suggestion in the article instead a hope to become a Devils' Advocate. Thanks, Saurabh |
|
dhadkan 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 22 of 377 ) It is pretty heartening to know that a fresh and new viewpoint exists. More heartening is the fact that OutlookIndia is publishing such radically different persperctives and epitomising the notion of free speech and democracy. Ms.Pratap has a point in her essay. She definitely sets the mind thinking and we Indians should really think whether the governments really want to solve this problem. Agreed, that Kashmir has become an issue of national pride and is of paramount importance for the politicians and the so-called nationalist Indians. But stop. Think is that really the most important problem India faces? Is it not necessary that the government tries to bring about a solution based not on pride and political interest but on justice and the interest of the 1 billion strong population? We must all agree that war is not a solution to this problem. It is definitely unwise to be the aggressor and the onus is on us - a democratic peaceloving country to try and restrain ourselves as much as we can from going to war. War may bolster the nationalistic and patriotic feeling but will not effect progress for India. It will on the contrary, push us to the wall in terms of the current problems we are facing like poverty, economic slump, technological progress etc. We as a nation must realise that gone are the days when we fight for borders. The new dawn of this century pushes us to fight for people. We must fight to make the lives of our countrymen better not worse. We must fight our wars against poverty, illiteracy , social inequality and lack of individual dignity. These are cliche statements echoed by many put rarely put into practice. But the whole of the country thinks in a very self-centered way. How does it harm anybody to say Kashmir is ours. We will not give it to anybody. It is our national pride. Relax, has anybody asked what the kashmiri feels about it. Your pride is hurting them the most. They are living life being pursued like in a hunting game. Pakistan claims it to be their's while India is clutching it with both hands. Kashimiris are tossed around. What would you want if you were a kashmiri? A life of peace. So lets ask them if they find peace with us or pakistan or as an independent state. The basics of the kashimir problem is that they feel cheated. They feel that their independence and their decison to stay out of any Indian or Pakistan control has been disrespected. True, their king signed the papers to save his country from pakistan. Had that not been done Pakistan would be holding kashmir which would have been equally bad for the kashmiris. But is'nt this a democracy. The king asked for help and we pressurized him to sign annexation if he wanted help. It was like a protection fee. Well but the people of kashmir also have a say like those of Junagadh had. The nizam wanted to merge with pakistan but India saying that people did not want to merge attacked and secured Junagadh. So why this double standard with kashmir. Actually if we are a noble country we must help them get Independent and with help from International community can help ensure that pakistan does not try and take control. We would be really democratic then. And do a plebisite. That way all will be represented. Yes many will argue that plebisite will not be fair as many have fled over the years from kashmir. Ok, lets sit down with Pakistan and say you stop terrorism and if we find that terrorism has stopped then we can conduct a plebisite after 10 years of normalcy. That would give sufficient time to those who want to settle back in kashmir. But I doubt anybody would do that. If they do they are not politicians but true democratic statesmen. Lets see if justice and fairness prevails. Meanwhile, we can celebrate free speech. Thanks to Arundhati Roy , Ms.Pratap and Outlook India. |
|
nvedwan 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 23 of 377 ) this is an excellent example of the routine rantings of cosmopolitan/rootless, pseudo-secular and self-appointed custodians of public morality who divide their time with great difficulty between sweden and US and the closest they ever come to knowing a muslim is when they met mf hussein (perhaps over Martinis and discussion of the mindless brouhaha (by the gauche)over the paintings of naked Saraswati). anyways the poisonous and visceral anti-majoritarianism, it seems, continues to be the staple of our discredited, intellectual/chattering classes. Steeped in the worst traditions of dogmatic secularism/elitism, these people conveniently forget that their recipe/fantasy for destroying a nation-state like India will spell doom for hundreds of millions of poor and powerless citizens whose only hope lies in a unified and effective state. But I guess in this age of absolute moral relativism, it is passe for purveyors of fashionable nonsense to even consider social well-being as worthy of consideration. To add insult to injury, incorrigible socialites (including such 'luminaries' as Khushwant Singh), that Ms Anita Pratap (proudly)represent, on account of their socio-economic status, are almost always completely exempt from the effects that their prescriptions would have if put into practice. It is this lack of accountability and freedom from consequences of their 'utterances' that leads transnational elites like Ms Pratap to take ever-more fanciful 'positions'with regard to issues of life and death. Afterall it's their insularity and alienation from what constitutes life and its accompanying hazards for ordinary citizens of their "own" countries that quailifies them for entry to the liberated, global arena. Free from all bonds of attchement to such 'contrived' entities such as the nation-state and community, these individuals' only loyality is to their own (enormously puffed)selves and whatever it takes to satisfy their insatiable appetites. Unfortuntely, for these egotistical monstrosities, I have some bad news. The bottom line is that the national interest (inclding people's right to a life free from terror) cannot be any longer held hostage to a handful of people's quixotian quest for (hedonistic)self-realization in utter diregard of the socially desructive consequences. In a democratic polity-however imperfect and lopsided- the significant and succesful policies will have to bend to the public will.The national destiny can no more be allowed to be sullied and hijacked by perverted and utterly self-absorbed whims of the anti-national few. |
|
dksesh 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 24 of 377 ) I am a little surprised. I dont care how a common Pakistani thinks for heavens sake. My country folks are dying because of Pakistani perversion and religious hysteria and we have people here advising us take care of a Pakistani. We have lost in excess of 10,000 people we neednt have, but for stupid Pakistani adventure. Lets get this straight. If Pakistan really wants things right, it should get rid of its religious high ground and give up terrorism as a means of crazy mideveal adventure. Is thats something we can expect from them, NO way, so they reap nthe fruits of their action. Its not our fault. Anitha should get her perspective right. Its easy to try and gain fame as a fantastic and kind hearted saadhu at the blood and life expense of my fellow countrymen. She should understand that not all countries including Pakistan are civilised, it requires a cane to teach such tribals something. Not intellectual sermons. You forget something Anitha, the Chinese angle in using the idiotic pakistanis as a tool in the whole game. The Pakistanis wont understand this and wont stop, so that gives us little chance to help them , really. - Seshadri. |
|
hi_madan 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 25 of 377 ) Wow, In the pretext of critisicing India, Ms.Anita has connivingly rubbed salt on our neighbours wounds. If that is what you wanted, you did a really good job of it. |
|
venumg 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 26 of 377 ) Hi, It's always better to view the other side of the coin. But at the expense of what? I donno whether a pakistani's blood pressure shoots up or not but u certainly made mine shoot up. Why don't you guys just keep your pseudo intellectual mouths shut. for gods sake....i've lost thousands and thousands of my fellow country men because of these religious fanatics. As long as people like you wanted to get name and fame, just that sort of negative publicity why don't you do something else. you say india did the same with srilanka. didn't india pay the price for it? You know what happened because of the mediation in this issue? we lost 1/3rd of out mother land. please don't try to preach things like these. We still take pride in being an indian and people like you makes us think twice....and make sure that our feelings get more stronger. Thanks for you in a way. but for gods sake why don't you guys think straight? |
|
dhingram 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 27 of 377 ) It is amazing to see that people like Anita Pratap think that they represent the view of the people of India. The editors of Outlook magazine have drifted far away from public mood over the last couple of years. After all, the media is supposed to reflect the mood of the people. This is in sharp contrast to the American media that has supported the government fully on its policy. I always wondered why Ms. Pratap left CNN (or maybe was kicked out), but now it seems I do not have to look any further. In the name of "objective" and "balanced" reporting the Outlook magazine has shifted to being unpatriotic. I agree, that this is a nation of free speech and democracy and every citizen has the right to express his/her view. However, being a part of the media also brings along a sense of responsibility that you turn around and demand of the politicians. I do not support the radical views that have been expressed on this message board that the magazine must be banned. I think that if people read such articles in the Outlook magazine, which was once trying to emulate India Today, people will realize how the editors and the publishers have failed. There is no need to ban magazines, instead I feel that people should stop reading such magazines and "boycott" them and that is how you will pull the rug from under their feet. They will be compelled to either shut down due to financial considerations or they will have to change their reporting and start to define what "objective" reporting actually means and not what they think it means. |
|
advik 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 28 of 377 ) As a proud Indian who has the right to criticise my country when I think it is doing something wrong I say this, I tend to agree with Anita, we have always criticised the US for its big brother, belligerent attitude, but here we are doing the same. Pakistan is the epicenter of terrorism, but for gods sake, lets give the General a little time, he has been the boldest leader they have had...ever, lets give him a litle credit. I know he dosent deserve it, he has shown his colours in the past and he dosent dererve anything from us, but the worlds eyes are thrust upon him and how he deals with the Kashmir issue is going to influence world opinion. The future of Pakistan depends on how he deals with fundamentalism. I dont care if he understands Pakistans folly in terrorism and is genuine about change or he is doing it with the threat of war, all I care about is his changing Pakistans policy on Kashmir. We have been one country for alot more time then we have been two, our cultural similarities are too many to mention. I do hope that Pakistan changes its path and decides to make money rather then jihadi's. This is an ideal time for Pakistan to get onto the right side of history, for its future and ours. |
|
dchittib 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 29 of 377 ) You Guys never fail to amaze me with your extreme left wing opinions. Ms. Pratap - great going!!! Never mind history, facts, and truths.. You Go Girl !! Sensationalize away... But the truth is, you got a long way to go before you come anywhere close to Ms. Eight Thousand Word Roy. She ofcourse thinks she is Chomsky of the female kind. And.. love and kisses for your poor little putty cat... The big bad wolf is out to get your putty cat huh... Oh! so sad !! :-) |
|
dchittib 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 30 of 377 ) Ms. Pratap writes... Forget the Pakistani Establishment... Think of the Poor Pakistani people... But don't forget the big bad bully Indian Establishment... Forget about all those foolish Indian public who are fed up with the proxy war... What do they know... Forget about all those normal people with spouses and kids, who run Big Companies... Oh... But dont forget about those BIG BAD Multi National companies that are after the poor man's blood and soul in 3rd. world countries... And never ever forget about that poor homeless person... ON and ON THEY GO.... ITS THE SAME LIBERAL BS... |
|
surbhat 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 31 of 377 ) Anitha has crossed limits and only an insane person can write something like this. I am amazed that outlook could even think of printing something like this. These so called intellectual left wing BS has reached it's peak in india. Amazing way to defend Jihadi terrorist killings of innocent indians!!, Yes it is common sense that india wants the world to pressurise Jihadi pak to give up terrorism, Also it is common sense that india does not want it's territory to be discussed and bifurcated by some western powers. Tomorrow if a few Mexican people in US decides to take a state with them and join Mexico will US let them do it??? Get a life Anitha |
|
AMReddy 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 32 of 377 ) This article is very bold. Too bold perhaps for those who can't stand dissent. It points out the present day foreign policy paradox. The role of the media is also to view the establishment's policy from a positive and critical perspective. Outlook has done well to maintain the balance. There seems to be a mistaken notion that is widely prevalent which treats criticism of government as unpatriotic. If that is so, we don't need discussion on any issue. Nor is there any reason for magazines to exist. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 33 of 377 ) From Vijay Sethia You said - Would you blame a Pakistani if he retorted: "Alas, there are no caves in Delhi for you to chase your temple-constructing sants into." "Temple constructing" is our internal problem and we will solve it. A Pakistani is not supposed to make any comment on that. You said - "What's perhaps most frustrating for Pakistanis is that somehow India always seems to get its way and have the last word too" I don't know how can you or some other Pakistani can have such feeling. In fact, I feel that it is Pakistan which always escapes unpunished for its misbehaviours/misadventures. Please tell me who has been the aggressor till now. India said that it will take two steps for each step Pakistan takes. India is still waiting for the first step from Pakistan (and also the terrorist list.)I think you are are confused between stop and jumping back to the same point. What India wants is a forward step from Pakistan. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 34 of 377 ) From Rakesh Is it outlook up to it again or it Ms Pratap doing us this favor.The school of thuoght which the writer belongs to always talks of "problems?", "let's", and something "different" for the sake of being different.Never ever they are part of any solution. If she is telling us to introspect over Kashmir, she's missed the point again.No indian can think as an "ordinary pakistani" . what do writers as these by always saying the pakistani people not the government. Are these two different?? is the pakistani govt. a villian and the people angels ?? The terrorists in tunes of lakhs. and the hate balloons that are sent. and it would be nice of such pathelogically "rational" writers to visit chat rooms where free thoughts are given vent to, they will realise they are living in a fool's paradise. Rathere I suspect that they know the rality but who would listen to such self proclaimed intellectuals of left variety if they dont be "different". |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 35 of 377 ) From Amit Sinha This story by Ms. Pratap is perhaps meant to be provocative. Any half witted observer with a clue will point out that all nations indulge in double standards when it concerns their vital interests. India, like the US, is no exception. Pakistan's adventure in Afghanistan through their proxy (Taliban) is a more telling example of this phenomenon than India's involvement with the LTTE. If Ms. Pratap's (naive) point is that India should at least consider an 'unbiased' third party mediator, personally I have no issue with that. However, with such hardened positions it will be an exercise in futility. Fact is that Kashmir was made part of the Indian union according to the rules defined by the British at the time. So, what could be the logical case for India 'ceding' Kashmir to Pakistan? Islam? Give me a break! I am sure that this reasoning can then also be extended to the rest of India with its 15% Moslem population. Further, if ordinary Kashmiris really felt so strongly about becoming a theocracy like Pakistan then Arabs and Chechens, etc. would not be needed to keep the terror alive. By all accounts Pakistan, itself founded on the basis of Islam, is a failing state. Furthermore, they are having difficulties keeping their own ethnic minorities in tow common religion notwithstanding. And whatever happened to the fact that this land has been part of India even before the Islamic conquerors forcibily imposed their religion and history over its people? Surely Ms. Pratap is aware of the brutal ethnic cleansing carried out over the years. Can any mediator ignore any of these realities? History aside, can one make a compelling case of voluntarily handing over a stratigically located piece of territory to such a 'retro' country as Pakistan? The only realistic solution here is that the LOC be formalized and each country accept that as their national boundaries. If Pakistanis have any sense, they will accept this (which is also the status quo) and focus on keeping other parts of their nation from falling apart. Remember the Durand Line and the Pashtun 'problem'? Unfortunately for Pakistanis, their country's obsession with India is driving them to distraction. They ought to realize that if not for occasional bailouts from 'donor' nations, Pakistan would become another Afghanistan. Suggest Ms. Pratap discard her rose colored glasses and get a grip on reality. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 36 of 377 ) From Yogi I was incredibly disgusted by the article by Anitha Pratap. Thank god we dont have people like her in power who formulate our policies or she would have sold our nation on a platter, sitting in her hometown, living in an Indian state which has recently become a country by itself. She lacks imagination, and intellectual foresight when she goes on criticizing the indian foreign policy on Kashmir. There are a few things she has to understand which are unassailable facts. 1) Kasmir is a part of India, Period. 2) One can never trust pakistan, 3)we should be able to and capable of doing anything to maintain our territorial integrity, if it means we adopt double standards fair enough I dont care, but the end justifies the means. Conceding kashmir to Pakistan will be the death knell to our nationhood. Godforbid people like her should shut up and keep their opinions to themselves. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 37 of 377 ) From Prashant Choudhary I think the thoughts behind this article are highly pedantic... |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 38 of 377 ) From Samit SK Another shallow anti Govt article ! Don't you run out of them ? When India gifted back captured territory and did not press hard terms in 1971, was this bullying ? When Vajpayee went to Lahore to meet Nawaz Sharif or when he called Mushy inspite of the General's Kargil schemes, was this being patronising? Please let us know this. Other than make a long winded speech to please his western mentors, what has Musharraf done so far ? If all those arrests indeed are intended to benefit India, what is the harm in waiting a couple of weeks to see if they really work on the ground? If a "house arrest" means posting a couple of policemen outside his home while Maulana Masood conducts business as usual inside, India has every right to keep its army on its borders. India is much beter off talking to Hurriyat than to the Pakistanis. We have very little time left until the J&K assembly elections. If we waste it in another media circus like that in Agra, we would have lost another historic opportunity. It is time to make peace in Kashmir. Let us continue to bleed Pakistan dry on the borders. Of course we don't want war. We have much more to loose. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 39 of 377 ) From Arif Reading the postings here one would not be faulted for thinking that only hate mongers filled with the desire to kill all those who don't share their views read the OUTLOOK. If there is one thing that unites Pakistanis and Indians its their sigular incapacity to deal with truth! I congratulate the OUTLOOK on its bold stance to publish all shades of views without fear or favour. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 40 of 377 ) From Sowrab I am an amature in this field but this is only my feelings and thoughts which come through. I read the article its quite impressing, i do advocate about peacefull settlement of the kashmir issue. the only thing i dont understand is kashmirism running in the blood of pakitanis eventhough pakistan does not claim kashmir as part of pakisthan. as for as india is concerned it claims kashmir as part of india and kashmiris fighting with indian forces is logical but why pakisthan makes it the central issue with india when it has nothing to do with kashmir as a state they can have a friendly relation with india and settle the issuse later as spain and britain did insted of fighting and obstructing the growth of each nation. any how there is no reason to belive pakisthan fighting with india will resolve the kashimr issue |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 41 of 377 ) From Abhijit Kane For quite a while I was seriously toying with the idea of discontinuing the OUTLOOK subscription. Thanks to the Verbal Diarrhea (& Mental constipation) by Anita Pratap in Jan & Feb issues, I have firmed up my decision to stop subscribing to your weekly bag of scum. (Though u keep on sending me those renewal forms every week Begging for renewal.) Two names can be recommended for this year's Nishaan-E-Pakistan Award ( The highest civilian award by the Pakistaani state establishment) : The great Ms. Anita Pratap, For being unofficial voluntary spokesperson of Pakistaan, & our 'Debonair' editor and the fountainhead of journalism in India, Mr. Vinod Mehta. ( For ur information Vinod in Indian language means Joke ! ) Show ur courage and magnanimity, which u constantly preach from rooftops, by publishing this FREESPEECH in ur next issue which will be my last issue (positively) of the subscription period. No regards Abhijit Kane |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 42 of 377 ) From R.Prabha First of all why do you call yopur magzine 'Outlook India' when there are more Indians who are fashionably anti Indian and 'intellectuals''liberals' expressing themselves? Do you see anything positive , commendable about the prime minister and others or ancient Indian culture or talk like the foreign newspapers. Dear Anita I think you need to take some lessons in Indian history before you spit fire to set your own house on fire. By the way what do the Hindu saints have to do with your article thast you drag them in. I think that is the fashinabe thing to be anti Hindu. One way to get published, I guess. Yours seems to be a very mixed up logic. Also it is very sad in the sense that when there is such threat to Indian security the Indian journalists should write like this. Look at the American Papers and their patriotism and unity after Sept.11. For them it is America first. Same is true about the people of America. If anybody touches America they are all united inspite of their differences. But even after the Dec.13th attack on the parliament neither the political parties nor some of the journalists have sense enough to see the danger and are using every opportunity to get some votes or attention |
|
chotu 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 43 of 377 ) It is just not possible to have third party mediation for Kashmir. It is due to the mere reason that India cannot give any concessions which paves way for the Pakistan accession of the entire Kashmir. I tried to forget that I’m an Indian and see the recent events through an ordinary Pakistani citizen’s eye. Yes, I feel terrorized and frustrated. Terrorized due to the fact That I’m getting the fruits out of the seeds (that of hatred) that I have sown, and frustrated because I’m helpless against India’s might. Kashmir has been an apple of content for 50 years because of major Political blunders done by our apex leadership for they allowed Pakistan to have a say and be a party to Kashmir politics. Just to have friendly relations and peace we allowed Pakistan to capture a major part of Kashmir now PoK , while going to the extend knocking at the door of U.N. India had a couple of chances to take back PoK but we never did for we are ahimsa loving people .We allowed hundred of invaders to plunder our country and take away our precious wealth for we are ahimsa loving people. For me as an Indian the Sir Creek’s dispute is that Pakistan is an aggressor who wants to take its revenge over India for the 1971 war, where it had to part with Bangladesh, earlier East Pakistan.. Musharraf has made important announcements, no one can deny it, but why can’t he deport those 20 terrorist asked by India. He doesn’t have any intentions for peace with India. One can be pressurized to announce something but until you point the gun on his head you won’t make him do things against ideas deep in his heart. One should always recall that Taliban the offspring of Pakistan was declared an orphan by its creator when Uncle Sam declared in his war against terrorism that either one is in his side or against him. So where the solution does lies to Kashmir problem. Let Pakistan accept the fact that Kashmir is an internal problem of India and shake his hand of its past policies towards Kashmir. Why can’t they do this if India can do away with LTTE. I’m really sorry to say that I can’t think and see the present event through an ordinary Pakistan citizen’s eye for earlier also I was never able to do the same through ordinary Taliban soldier’s eye. |
|
BATYAR01 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 44 of 377 ) Kashmir issue was solved with the signing of instrument of accession by ruler of J & K at the time of Partition of India, in accordance with conditions laid down by British rulers for division of country. After 55 years of independence the wounds and hatred between Hindu's and Muslims in India has to a large extent healed now. There are nearly 150 million Muslims living as part and parcel of India. They are very much soul and blood of country as any other community in India. India has a secular fabric. Do you want to repeat the mayhem of 1947 by handing over Kashmir, the only Muslim Majority State of India to Pakistan or making it independent? Pakistan was formed on the basis of hatred of India. They hate us so much that terrorists crossing into India; separate innocent passengers from buses, or residents from a locality on the basis of Religion and all innocent non-Muslims are killed, and even the children are not spared and this is a state sponsored terrorism. So it will be crazy to think any Kashmir solution is going to stop the hatred and enmity by Pakistan against India. Hence no second thoughts, it is necessity to cut the head of serpent before it strikes. |
|
ajays 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 45 of 377 ) Ms Pratap I am an ex army officer who served in the valley in CI ops between 1991-1993, I can therefore claim a modicum of knowledge of ground level realities. While there is a ground swell of resentement against India amongst the Muslim population there is none amongst the Pandits or the Buddhists or the Sikhs or the Dogris, as matter of fact they are pertrified at the thought of Kashmir being handed over to the Muslims. You are in denial if you are saying that Pakistan is an innocent and aggrived party in this affair. Take it from me... their military is activly supporting insurgency at all levels just as they were doing in Punjab. Now after 10 years of tolerating this are you suggesting that India is not justified in putting the same pakistani military on the mat and rubbing their noses in?? Please listen to yourselves, i have lost a number of excellent Indian collegues who have been often times shot in the back or sniped at by hidden terrorists do you want to desecrate their memory by capitulating to coercion?? Ms Pratap could you please shed some light on Pakistan's locus standi on Kashmir, If they are so concerned about the soverignity of the Kashmiris and Kashmir why have they ceded Kashmiri territory to China?? Pakistans military is untrustworthy and has a self serving agenda, India present approach is correct and befitting of a strong Nation State Jai Hind |
|
slasher 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 46 of 377 ) There is no question of third party mediation in the internal affairs of our country. BTW. The problem is between India and a section of the population of J& K. Pakistan is the third party that is fishing and is certainly not mediating in troubled waters and with no locus standi in the matter. Are we talking of FOURTH PARTY INTERVENTION MS. PRATAP ??? |
|
mohinder 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 47 of 377 ) I have the real solution to the Kashmir problem!! The real issue is that if some Kashmiris want to join Pakistan, let us kick their butt and send them to the evil land. But the real estate of Kashmir will always be with India. After all the Hindus and sikhs and some muslims left their real estate in Paadistan in 1947. Similarly the muslims who went to Pakistan left their real estate here. The boundries are final!! Pakistan is an evil terrorist state which has only allah, mulla, lulla and burka. It has an industry of AK47's and heroin smugglng. No democracy, no dating, no dancing, no music, no debate. Only hate allah, mulla and burka. Clearly it is an evil enterprise. One fine day Aunty publicity..( arundhati roy and now anita pratap) may want to defend it. But bullshit. India should have nothing to do with it..... |
|
reader 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 48 of 377 ) My response to the article by Ms Anita Pratap is not directed at the writer (because I believe this article is nothing else than the attempt of gaining cheap publicity by an oppurtunist writer) but the editor of the web site who is not justifying his post ("EDITOR") by making all the readers go thru crap like this. We all know the sincerity and effectiveness of the steps by pakistani president, then who is Ms Pratap trying to fool ? Only herself !! The saying is "Once bitten, twice shy" but people like Ms Anita pratap advocate for Indians to take unnumerable hit before resopnding. |
|
ajays 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 49 of 377 ) Ms Pratap another point that i missed commenting on, take it from me India did not ask US to request Pakistan to withdraw from Batalik (incidentally india had already retaken Tiger hill and Toolong severly interdicting the supply routes to the remanents of NLI) India told Clinton that it was ready to impose a Naval blockade and launch a full scale offensive in Rajasthan if Pakistan did not withdraw, there was no mediation. You forget that it was the same India which was undertaking the lahore initiative when the Kargil buildup was clandestinely taking place, it was the same India which returned 80000 pow(in one peice and not disembowelled) and got nothing in return, the same India forgave Bangladesh when 35 BSF men were anhillated on the eastern border, who are you calling a bully Ms Pratap?? |
|
asharam 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 50 of 377 ) Anita Pratap, please improve your General Knowledge or may I say Please stop trying to gain cheap publicity. You can have other means to do so, Believe Me. But not at the cost of the patritism towards your Country. Its because of the people like you who keep demanding "What has my country done for ME?" ha, in your case "What has my country done for the world/or Pakistan?". Please stop asking such questions. Before doing so Ask yourself "What have you done for your country?" other than publicly accussing your country at this hour when our needs us. Remember "The most committed wins". Unless you are not committed towards your country like I can see from your immature judgement and your poor General knowledge, dont ask such questions. It only shoots my blood pressure hatf missiles Ms ANITA PRATAP. |
|
shailen 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 51 of 377 ) After reading comments by many Patriots, I decided to give my opinion. We, as Indians, need to understand that patriotism is a good thing but jingoism is bad. We should make ourselves emotionally more stable so that we can learn from criticism. Only when we know what's wrong we can fix it and move forward. Its an irony that we are only a little better then the people whom we critisize most (read Pakistanis or Islamic fundamentalists). We vote corrupt leaders, we bribe govt. officials, we throw shit on roads, we have no guts to stand alone, we vandalize in groups ..... etc etc. And if someone reminds us of these things ...we have our blood boiling. Anita was only talking of Pakistani people ..the civilians who have nothing to do with policy makers...just like you or me have nothing to do with 'Chara Ghotala' (Fodder scam) or Bofors scam. We do not control our own politicians and we vote them to power again and again so how can we expect Paki people to be responsible for their military establishment's actions. History or Kashmir issue is unknown to most of the Indians and we only know what we have been told by our leaders or our govt's controlled education system. (Do you think a muslim suicide bomber knows what he's doing?? No, he 'think' he knows but he's been brainwashed over the years). Don't want to go further into details but would like to request readers to be patient and respect other's opinions. You do not have to agree with other person but you should try to be positive and ask questions rather passing judgements based on your prejudices. Last thing that India need is fanatisism. Stop supporting Shiv Sena / RSS which are nothing but hindu version of Jamaat E Islami. Also, I must say that those who have not seen or experienced how it feels to be among the showering bombs are bullets, are the ones who are very eager to see the action. War is definitly glamorous on screen but trust be ..its not something we need. Till we are not pushed to the end, we should not think of war as an option and yes ..we need to fix things are our own home also. Like it or not, hypocrisy can't be masked for a long. God bless India. |
|
laksast 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 52 of 377 ) Dear Ms. Pratap, it is not India that is acting pompous and condescending, but by putting out half-truths and appearing saintly, it is you who is displaying sanctimonious pomposity in your article: First of all, let me tell you that Pakistan is not intimidated one bit by India's military posture. They are itching for a fight. They know very well that should India launch into an attack, most likely things will stalemate, and US-led west will step in to set things right. This is their game plan. India's stragetgy is to utilize the current anti-terrorism climate in the globe to put maximum diplomatic and military pressure on Pakistan to force them to renounce terrorism as an instrument of state policy. As a reporter, you ought to know that India has tried everything it can do to talk with Pakistan, and bring peace to J&K and you know how things have been scuttled. Need I remind you of Lahore, need I remind you of PM Vajpayee's ramzan cease-fire offer, and need I remind you of Agra? Your piece smacks of the kind of ignorance US media displays where Musharaff is hailed as a great peacemaker for the U-turns he has taken in the recent past, notwithstanding this history of belligerence, hostility, and terror he has perpetuated against India, most notably Kargil. Naturally, India is going to take its time because of the trust factor. Noted scholar and Kashmiri professor at JNU, Amitabh Mattoo, sums up India's dealings with Pakistan in the following we-researched article: http://www.hinduonnet.com/thehindu/2001/12/24/stories/2001122401311000.htm I must point out one blatant, erroneous analogy you draw in your piece above. You compare India's demand that Pakistani extradite 20 hard-core terrorists being harbored in that country with 'temple building sants' in India. Your analogy is outrageous for the simple reason that the terrorists harbored by Pakistan have committed egregious crimes against the Indian state, while the 'temple building sants', abhorrent they may be to a lot of Indians, have not committed any crimes against the state of Pakistan. So, it would be pre-posterous for Pakistan to demand their extradition as you seem to be suggesting. Finally, let me caution you against sympathizing too much with the average Pakistani man/woman on the street using the standard peacenick mantra that all is well between the people of India/Pak and its only the political elite that fish in troubled waters. A noted historian once said that a people may not always get a government that they deserve, but certainly the governments that they produce time and again reflect the ethos, the culture, and by and large the outlook of the people. To this end, hatred of India, and more importantly hatred of Hindus is firmly imbued in the psyche of most Pakistanis, especially their Punjabi elite, and this is reflected in the perpetual hostility towards India that every Pakistani government has displayed. Most Pakistanis still believe and are made to believe that everything notable in the subcontinent, the culture, the music, the art, etc is the legacy of the Mughal rule and Hindus have made no contribution whatsoever. In short, India-Pak tensions reflect a deep civilizational and religious divide, and Pakistani behavior to date has only deepened this divide since 1947. The sanctimonious, self-righteous tone of your article does little justice to capture this hard fact. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 53 of 377 ) From Pramod This story is absolutely right! And I am not much surprised that Outlook ran it! But what I feel so sad is, majority of Indians dont seem to realise these basic facts! And I should say that India press, despite the enormous amount of freedom they enjoy, haven't contributed much to deescalatiing the problem. I am reminded of the Seagulls sticking with the flock in Richard Bach's Jonathan Livingston Seagull! I would request Outlook to spearhead a movement to analyse straight forward solutions to problems in india, which if solved, we could start focussing on real aspects of development, like education, sanitation, infrastructure etc. I recently spent a short vacation in India. Made a trip from Delhi to Udaipur and back. By train and by bus! It was really sad the way things were! I don't see a single reason, why Indians should have to live such a horrible life! They should be given an opportunity to develop and use thier skills. And that is not going to happen unless they are able to obtain right education, and are able to rise above daily nitty gritties of life. Thanks for this article. I hope some more Indian's change their way of thinking, and start to fly! |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 54 of 377 ) From Dhruv Katoch As an Army Officer, I was deeply moved by Anita Pratap's well-reasoned article, "Bully, Know Thyself". Obviously, India is a bully. We have no business to defend ourselves. So what if thousands of soldiers have been killed over the past two decades in Pakistan inspired and funded insurgency. A soldier's life is expendable and he must die for his country to meet the ego and secular requirements of our great intellectuals. Is not the soldier paid from taxpayer's money such as collected from the likes of Ms Pratap, who sweat and toil writing such wonderful articles for such great magazines. Especially if such people need to curry favour with their white masters so that they can be termed liberal and progressive. In fact, the life of any Indian is not worth a dime especially if he is unfortunate enough to be born into the majority community. But God forbid if a Staines or such like is killed. That life is precious as is Ms Pratap's. Nice and white, and if not white, at least propagating the white man's cause and his religion and beliefs. Also, it pleases me a great deal to learn from the learned Lady that the ordinary Pakistani is having sleepless nights. And all this while I thought that the common Pakistanis were rather thrilled at the prospect of bleeding India dry, not only in Kashmir, but in dastardly attacks carried out on hapless civilians in the North East and in other parts of the country. How badly have I misjudged the common mood in Pakistan! I also totally support Ms Pratap's sarcastic remarks on our temple constructing Saints. Hindu's have no right to build a temple, as we are a secular country. But of course, we must support the rights of the minorities to build their places of worship, especially if they conform to Western precepts of the concept of God. Please visit the North East, Ms Pratap. Your heart will swell with pride. Isn't it a sign of secularism, if a Hindu widow cannot get a government job unless she converts? Finally, I must thank Ms Pratap for something, which is perhaps unintended. If we ever go to war, I now know the type of Indians I am defending. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 55 of 377 ) From Krishna Mokashi At the end of ranting and raving against India, Anita concendes -- "What's perhaps most frustrating for Pakistanis is that somehow India always seems to get its way and have the last word too" ...and goes ahead talking good things happening in India. It's really amazing that Anita goes whining without first trying to find the reason behind that "somehow" in her own sentence. Except for raising her blood pressure, her rantings serve NO other purpose. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 56 of 377 ) From Gupta When are you moving to Pakistan? |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 57 of 377 ) From Nihar Panda If the jehadis are out of ISI's hands, the Pakistani people and media should first question the policies of its army. Instead, they are going ga-ga over the January 12th address to the nation of their dictator-turned-president and accuse India on being too rigid in not appreciating the General's "motives". But they conveniently forget that it is India which has been wronged at Pakistan's hands on Dec 13th and much before during the decades of terrorism. Pakistan has to start be getting rid of it's anti-India mentality and take concrete steps to vaccum-clean its territory of the so-called jehadis it has raised for years. If and only if that happens, the ball will finally be in India's court. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 58 of 377 ) From Ravi Sheer crap.Please do not notice that ISI is and was never a separate institute.Its a farce drama being played by Pakistan when they say ISI acts on its own and that its CEO isnt a part of it or what ever.Hopefully I will never see srticles fromm this author again on this web site.OK we are bullying Pakistanis..WEhat else should we do?Wear bangles and watch while the terrorists create havoc all over the country?First in the priority comes our interests and then what ever .You seem to be a thinker of the Nehruvian mould.Let Ram save us all Indians from people like you |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 59 of 377 ) From Gopi Attaluri Wow! What an insight! Pakistan, that pinnacle of peace, is bullied by that big, needling neighbor! We sure know that the favorite destination for terrorists and hijackers is not Pakistan. We also know that India was the aggressor that invaded Pakistani land in that Kargil war. Of course, Pakistan never supported and fed that terrorist-infested Taliban government. I am sure enlightened, Ms. Author! |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 60 of 377 ) From Anand I am just wondering is this a Pakistani magazine or an Indian Subscription. By the two articles: PAK BOARD STIFF-AGHA AKBAR , THRUST AND PARRY- MARIANA BAABAR, it does seem that OUTLOOKINDIA is a PAKI subscription. I regularly visit paki news and magazine website and yet to read articles written by an INDIAN bashing the Pakistani establishment or even condemning the Pakistani sponsored proxy war( EXCEPT KULDIP NAYAR's PERIODIC INDIA BASHING IN THE DAWN). But it seems utterly clear that Indian magazines do provide Paki scribes a good platform to bash the Indian establishment. OUTLOOKINDIA seems to be doing this exactly. Now don't respond to me by saying that we are a democratic country and that we are different from Pakistan where we allow people from across the border to express their ideas(read HATRED AND ANGER FOR INDIA). Sorry we don't want ideas and view from people across the border. OutlookIndia as the name suggest is a look at INDIA and NOT Pakistan. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 61 of 377 ) From Krishnan Nayar Hooray for "Outlook India" for daring to publish Anita Pratap's article on India' s terribly cruel bullying of Pakistan! It really is a shocking situation, and I am pleased that at least one Indian has had the courage to stand up against this tormenting of poor old Pakistan. However, I don't think Pakistan's plight is nearly as bad as Anita thinks. Thank God you are not a Pakistani, says Anita, otherwise you would suffer so terribly from high blood pressure because of India's unjust pressure!.....Well, I think there is a very simple cure for Pakistanis' tragically high blood-pressure: Anita should just call to their attention the 40,000 or so Indians who have been killed by terrorists sent by the Pakistanis over the last decade, the fact that many more Indian soldiers have been killed in this proxy war than in all the full Indo-Pak wars. Recollection of such sweet details will cool Pakistani blood to an altogether delicious temperature. But Anita is 100% right that India would be practising dreadful "double-standards" in refusing the World the right to intervene in the Kashmir dispute. The World knows so much about the rights and wrongs of the dispute, and we must never go against World opinion. The opinion of merely 1,000 million Indians in a democratic country is nothing: that can't be called World Opinion. No, it is the opinion of vastly bigger nations, thoroughly democratic nations, like Saudi Arabia, that is real World opinion. Let us run to invite their well-informed and impartial intervention in our affairs!! Otherwise we are guilty of double standards! Thank God you are not a Pakistani, says wise Anita. Actually, I don't agree on that point. It seems to me to be far better to be even a Pakistani, or anything, than an unbelievably brainless Indian like Anita. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 62 of 377 ) From Sandy Well this is one of the dumbest articles i have ever read.the author is first guilty of over simplification and worst of all she refers to LTTE so much implying if past actions of a nation contrdict current policy then the nation is a hypocrite or bully!! India's support of LTTE then was consistent with world policy then and the fact we completely broke ties with them once we realized that they were not on the correct path is indication of our good intentions. If we bring out issues in history no nation can justify its current policies. Let's start with american support to islamic jihad against russians during cold war. so just beacuse they aided them 20 years back does not mean they US cant go against them now.so please stop using the LTTE example. regd kashmir in particular. the main point is this when the erstwhile raja was still vacillating pakistan sent in its forces ILLEGALLY. so using illegal means to justify a cause makes any merits inherent in that cause null and void. secondly, any nation has the right to protect its sovereignity and there are some issues that are simply unnegotiable.if any referendum is to be taken it should be across the whole nation on whether any territory can secede.this is because the states were not developed in isolation but have huge material\emotional investment from all citizens of the nation.and countries based on religion\language are not the way to go.if so what after J&K is independant and Jammu and Ladakh want independance because the hindu&skih&buddhist majority want to break from J&k??? how "fine grained" are we willing to go in this quest for a geographical region of homogeneous religious\language profile.what if a district in J&K suddenly becomes jewish and demands merger with Israel.will world support this even though technically a referendum in that district will support it. finally the author seem to be one of those who beleive that freedom of speech comes without any responsibilty.her article is intellectually hollow and does not have any deep understanding of issues at hand.her oversimplification of issues makes her a good person to write cheap bollywood thrillers but not indepth articles with good analysis.however i am all for freedom of speech and that is the only saving grace for this sensation mongering piece of trash.it just shows we have a sound system for protecting freedom of speech though i wish she uses it with more responsibilty!!! |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 63 of 377 ) From K B Balmurali Dear Ms.Anita, My comments as under are applicable only if you are an Indian citizen. If you are not, kindly ignore the same. I was disgusted to call myself a fellow Indian of yours after reading your write up on Indo - Pak relations in the latest issue of Outlook. When one American soldier gets killed, the whole country unites and is up against the enemy. When hoardes of Indian Soldiers gets killed............ cowards in the disguise of Champions of peace go on their knees, extending arms of friendship with the enemy. The Kargil war was won by our brave jawans, many of whom took bullets on their chests to protect you. Please do not give the credit to Bill Clinton. If yo are given a chance to rule the country, I am sure, within months you will ensure that we disintegrate like Soviet Union. I HAVE SEEN SAFFRON/ HINDU ALLERGIC PEOPLE, BUT IN YOU I SEE INDIA ALLERGY. If you call Temple Contructing sants as terrorists, could you please clarify, how many people have they killed and what has been there anti-India activities. Alas, centuries of slavery has not thought us lessons. More than our Kith and Kin, Indians seem to be worried about forigners. FOR A SECOND IMAGINE OUR SOLDIERS GIVING THEIR LAST DROP OF BLOOD FOR THE MOTRHERLAND IN THE BORDERS, READS YOUR ARTICLE. WHAT WILL BE HIS MORALE. HE WILL FEEL........ 'IS IT WORTH SACRIFICING AND FIGHTING FOR UNPATRIOTIC AND UNGRATEFUL CITIZENS LIKE YOU? " Shame on You. Pls ignite the flame of self-respect and patriotism. Best Regards |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 64 of 377 ) From NSM Nath Silly, know thyself! Anita, for some one so stupid you seem to have the knack of getting the best out of Indians. Do you know Indian History? Or better still, do you even know why India is angry with Pakistan? It seems to me you went to a college that taught you to use reverse logic in writing up your 'stories'. The editor of Outlook must be a worried man. Obviously he neither reads nor edits the stuff that appears on his Web site. If I were the editor I wouldn't even want to respond to the idiot who sent me this piece of garbage. Instead, 'Vinod' Mehta (what an appropriate first name!) decides to publish it and tries a cheeky tactic of enhancing his Web site's page hits. Bravo 'Vinod'! Many readers have commented where you have gone wrong and if you read them carefully, it will help you write a few new 'stories'. You are such an airhead and may be you are trying too hard to earn the affections of a Ms A. Roy. This should help and very soon you two could be writing more of this kind of stuff. May be there is a biz class ticket via China to attend a mushaira in Lahore in the company of ole Pervert Musaffir, himself! Even CNN could not handle you because you must have been terrible. Try harder. Disgusted... |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 65 of 377 ) Message Deleted by Free Speech Host |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 66 of 377 ) the mother fucking bitsch anita pratap should be arrested for sedition. i demmand action from the govt. of india. |
|
ajays 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 67 of 377 ) Luvmann please get a hold of yourselves, while I do not agree with ms pratap on this particular issue, I have a lot of respect for her as a journalist, she has impeccable credentials and has often done path breaking reporting. By using profanity on this forum you are desecrating yourselves and indeed our country |
|
kwn 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 68 of 377 ) As the Kashmir issue and Indo-Pak relationship are in the news are some time now, we need to look into the possible solutions to the existing problems. Author may be right in saying India's double standard on the Kashmir policy, but at the same time, it is bitter truth that Pakistan is engaged in anti-India activities at all levels. So in this situation what could be resolution of Kashmir issue. India can not afford to go for plebisite or give Kashmir to Pak. And on the other hand, it is very hard to expect from Pak's military to change their stance on kashmir because it is the sole cause of their survival. I am not sure what both countries will get out of it even if they start talking with their rigid attitude. The most easy solution for India to accept is conversion of LOC to international border and it remain to be seen how long it takes for Pak to agree to it, which seems unlikely. And if this does not happen then violence and chaos will go on. |
|
mave1 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 69 of 377 ) Dear Anita Pratap Your Impressions for the week ending 4.02.02 are as refreshing as the cool breeze from a river on a hot and humid noon and bold, frank and incisive enough to qualify for an Oscar, no, I mean a Pulitzer. I wish there are more gutsy journalists like you in our country. We desperately need them. I am hoping your piece will inspire some to similar derring-do. Who knows the panjandrums at the foreign office, or is it external affairs, this side of the border, may just sit up and take notice. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 70 of 377 ) Message Deleted by Free Speech Host |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 71 of 377 ) Message Deleted by Free Speech Host |
|
toronto 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 72 of 377 ) bravo! i have been reading and listening news related to kashmir since my childhood. And i have figured it out, that india is biased when it comes to kashmir and kashmiri people. When we have supported seperation of east pakistan(Bangladesh)movement and we as india call it legitimate then why not kashmir, people of kashmir should be given the right of self determination. |
|
sgupta99 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 73 of 377 ) My Dear Anita, Don't know if I should cry or laugh at your piece of rubbish called an article. I am not an Indian citizen but was born in India. I might not have all the right to say this but India is not the one who is bullying Pakistan. Hindu Kaffirs and other Kaffirs of India are not the one spreading hate in the name of religion. India's state policy is not terrorism. PTV is not banned in India. These are all the acts of bully. We have outlook india which publishes article by Paki Journalist but you won't find many B.Raman's editiorial or columns in a Paki publication. BTW, Kargil was not India's act of war. Bully only struck back when the wimps took over the bully's positions. I say..ck pakistan and all the Mullah's that dream of ruling India. Plus, let get rid of all the Mann Singh's of India that love peace but are not willing to sacrifice anything if the peace is threatened by a rouge nation like Pakistan. **ck Pervert Mush and his cohorts and whores. **ck Pakistan. |
|
kkn 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 74 of 377 ) Pakistan is sponsoring terrorists in the Indian state of Jammu and Kashmir. The government of India is fighting the terrorists there. When this is the case India has a legitimate right to defend herself by even waging a war against Pakistan. Before waging such a war India is trying diplomacy to make Pakistan stop sponsoring terrorism. For this reason India wants US and other countries and Indian ministers travel to the USA and so on. But when the question of the state of J&K arise, Pakistan has no right over it, Jammu and Kashmir is a legal state of the Union of India ( if you want more information please visit http://www.rediff.com/news/arvind.htm and read about Pakistani lies on Kashmir). Why should India discuss the status of Jammu and Kashmir with Pakistan when J & K is a part and parcel of India ?, if discussing the issue with Pakistan itself is not needed why should you involve a third country here ? So where do you see double standards here ? |
|
kkn 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 75 of 377 ) Regarding the LTTE issue, may be India supported it at one point, but that is not due to a state policy of exporting terrorism or the bullying nature of India as a whole, but purely because of the wrong policies of the government at that time. It is a long time now that India stopped any support to LTTE. If India's aim is to bully Sri Lanka, it would have continued supporting LTTE till date. You might as well know that India is even refusing a place for negotiations for LTTE with the Sri Lankan government now. So dont blame India for LTTE issue now. Yes, if Pakistan takes one step India has said it will take two steps. Pakistan always appears to take a step and never takes it. It is not enough to say you are banning an organization but you should effectively implement it. Why dont you read the articles by B Raman in the same outlook that published your article to know what Pakistan means when it says it takes a step ? But... even if Pakistan takes a genuine step of implementing its words, the only step that India should take is de escalation and nothing more than that. It is said the 'bigness' of India bothers Pakistanis, who to blame for that ? If they have an inferiority complex let them all go to a Psychiatrist. Who made India to be on red alert ? instead of pissing in their pants now why didn't they think about this earlier ? Yes, seeing India's map is intimidating for a Pakistani, thats why they want to break India into pieces and the article seems to support that. |
|
kkn 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 76 of 377 ) If India had been a bully it would have abrogated the Indus river water treaty long back, it hasn't done so even now. Have you heard of the controversy about Katcha theevu ( a small island inbetween India and Sri Lanka) ? Political parties in Tamil Nadu are for reclaiming the island from Sri Lanka. Whether the claim is justified or not is another matter ( bullies dont bother whether their cause is justified or not), but the fact that India has never staked its claim not bullied Sri Lanka to hand over the island should be an eye opener to you. Indian armed forces went to Maldives on the request of Gayoom to help him thwart the coup, if India had been a bully it would have maintained its army and later on navy there, which will turn out to be a startegic location but on the other hand India recalled its army promptly once the task is over. Take the countries of SAARC, apart from Pakistan, Bangladesh and Nepal ( where severe misinformation about India is being spread by vested interests ) which other SAARC country feels bullied by India ? |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 77 of 377 ) Message Deleted by Free Speech Host |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 78 of 377 ) From Kris This is the most stupid article i have ever read in my whole life. Sure there may be civilians who are worried about the tensions. But the general trend and frenzy is to hate India and this is deep rooted. As to Kashmir being the central Issue, it has been pointed that the erstwhile Maharaja has signed accession to India. Why can't this less powerful neighbor forget what is history and concentrate on its own development? and stop being a constant irritant? For what this country has been perpetrating for the past half a century if it were another country like US or Israel suffering like India Pakistan would have perished long back. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 79 of 377 ) Luvvman, We are constrained to remove those of your messages which have been found objectionable by many users who have written in to complain. Please exercise restraint in your speech as lots of women readers have written in to say that they find your abusive language off-putting, repulsive and repugnant which keeps them away from wanting to participate. If we find your persisting in abuse, we'd feel constrained to have your registration cancelled and should it persist under another name, to write to your IP for abuse and suitable action. Please note that while dissent and even insult is part of a lively exchange, a certain degree of civility is required in any public forum. If nothing else, it detracts from any substantive arguments/points you actually may have, or perceive to have. Please co-operate and honour the wishes of other users. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 80 of 377 ) From Rajesh Talreja Sorry! Can't compare India's LTTE misadventure with ISI. It was a mistake which we corrected (or tried to) and paid for, by fighting LTTE with our own blood and subsequently loosing Rajiv Gandhi too. Indian democracy not unlike other democracies is largely self correcting. Can't compare it with self run ISI which has no one to accout itself to. Complete destruction of Afghanistan and Talibanization of Kashmir are a case in point. Although I agree we need third party mediation, you can't blame India for not wanting one. After all the plebisite offer (which we volunteered) was conditional to troop withdrawal from Pakistani Kashmir, which never happened. These things aught to have a deadline, don't they? And what about the peace and prosperity of Kashmir up untill late 80s? Wars are between armies but Pakistan's ISI doesnot believe in any rules of engagement. Jehad, for them, is a fair game. They help romantisize it in under previledged population in the neighborhood and have no problem unleashing it on their own brathren, be they in Afghanistan India or Bangladesh. |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 81 of 377 ) From Shival After reading your article, all I can say is: "National Interest". |
|
Admin 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 82 of 377 ) From Geeta Shetty Has the condition of 3 lakh kashmiri pandits troubled you? No way. Only the fate of foreign missionaries like the Staines troubles you Christians. A hindu life is there for the take. i wish you or one of your closest family members perish in one of the ISI triggered bombings in India. Maybe your Christian heart would cry in pain, then the same way you cry for the Staines. Shame on you for speaking ill of the country that allows you the space toe eat and defecate. You pig eaters cry for the Pakis and not your own countrymen dying daily in Kashmir. Thank your lucky stars you continue to live in peace in Hindu majority states of India, while you show less magnanimity towards Hindus in Nagaland etc. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 83 of 377 ) dear mr. admin, i accept your views and fully endorse it. i use abusive language only as a tactic. it is not personal. however, your view is noted. let me tell you this woman's article i an affront to the self respect of the country. it is an afront to the brave jawans who lay down their lives for our country. i am dumb founded at the intellengence or the lack of it of this woman. actually, it is anita pratap who should be censored. her words are lot more harmful than my filthy language. i do not like to use filthy language but there is a limit to journalistic license, and this moron has crossed it. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 84 of 377 ) dear admin, take this article off your magazine and apologize to the armed forces of our country. it is the least you can do. such stupid articles should not be published. i have had enough of these anti-national, corrupt, communist, shameless jouranlists on the payroll of foreign countries and intelligence agencies indulging in anti-hindu and anti-india propaganda. stop this non-sense. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 85 of 377 ) dear admin, let me tell this stupid woman who calls herself ajournalist that she is an insult to journalism. she is an insult to our country. she is worse than a rat. let me tell her that jammu and kashmir is an integral part of india. no power can change that. there is no mediation on what belongs to us. pakistan is an affront to civilized society. they are fucking fanatics. if anita pratap wants to live in her dear pakistan, tell her to fuck off and live there. we will defend jammu and kashmir till the last drop of our blood. we will kill and be killed for it. there are still some brave and patriotic people left in india. thank god. |
|
vani 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 86 of 377 ) For Anita Pratap: * Shut Up * |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 87 of 377 ) this is a direct appeal to the govt. of india and the CBI to investigate anita pratap's links to the pakistani establishment and ISI. i have no doubt in my mind that she has been paid off to write this stupid article. such shameless behavior is not pardonable. the dead jawans of kargil are turning in their grave. |
|
thetruth 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 88 of 377 ) Anita is a typical Idiot outlook can boast of. Anitaji should stop pronouncing her idiotic judgement to India and lesser mortals Indians. She will do us a great favor simply by shutting up. (Please , Madamji, leave us alone.. Or are you expecting something like nishan-e-pakistan ??)..... No wonder , "liberals" like Anita can sell whole of India and India's pride , if it is to gain international recognition. It is INDIA , so the Witches like Anita can live peacefully, ,....in China she would have been hanged in public. |
|
thetruth 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 89 of 377 ) Admin saab , don't u have any control over the articles published in outlook??Please , tell vinodji,.... outlook will sell even if it becomes pro-India.May be u lose some pakistani subscribers .. |
|
thetruth 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 90 of 377 ) May be b...s like Anita will find this statistics interesting...(still her dirty heart will will bleed for "peaceloving" pakistanis ).......In 1941 Hindu population in Pakistan 25% , in 1948 it is 17% , in 1991 it is less than 1.5%...... Anita madamji , please don't call this "communal statistics" . How is Norway Anitaji, I think u should start working for Norway and rest of the world. PLease madam , forget India , kindly leave this country alone . |
|
chait 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 91 of 377 ) What piece of crap! Im not that much angry at Anita Pratap who is a journo-prostitute and paid to write shit like this, but at outlookindia to print shit like this. When Pakistan is busy fighting India , Indian newspapers are ocupied fighting India too. I thought u had a conscience Outlook, look at the western media whom u guys ape, do they ever write bullshit about their country ? their is not one iota of truth in her rantings. Why do u Indian editors fell pleased when you bring down your own country. You media guys dont even call the terrorists in Kashmir as that, u call them militants, ultras etc etc. If u have the balls go fight along with the Indian Army there, and then dare to call India a "Bully". India a "Bully" is the worst oxymoron possible. Looks like Anita Pratap aand Outlook watch PTV too much. |
|
mushtaq 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 92 of 377 ) Pakistan & India should solve their disputes bilaterly discussions instead of third part mediation.Third part has its own interests in this area Third part can exploit both of us |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 93 of 377 ) thanks chait, for exposing the rundy anita pratap and outlook traitors. it is shameful we have people like this in our country. what can i say. we can only pray and hope that better sense will prevail over these bastards. it is unbelievable isn't it. there is not one newspaper in america that criticizes the govt. for its war. look at indian journalists and then you can know why india has been ruled by foreigners. it is not a mystery, is it. look at vinod mehta, look at kuldip nayyar, look at all those traitorous morons. god help us. |
|
bob147 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 94 of 377 ) anita pratap should continue her dainty life at Djinns and floats and forget about eriting essays on Indian political issues. For all you know she was badly hung over from heavy drinking at an upmarket pub the evening before she wrote her article. Such pseudos should be banned from this country. |
|
vishag 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 95 of 377 ) Reading that article , I WOULD DEFINITELY BE GLAD TO BE A PAKISTANI , AT THE SAME TIME I AM SO SAD TO BE AN INDIAN. An Indian only calls , in India A SANT = A TERRORIST and TERROR ACTS = CONSTRUCTION OF TEMPLE. Illiterate democracy can be so self destructive. My God. |
|
Shashi71 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 96 of 377 ) Phir Bhi Dil Hai Hindustani Dear Anita, It was really bold article from you. Kudos ! It really forces you to think whether India is BULLY ? Here are my 2nd thoughts on your thoughts. Para 1 : I am also glad that u were not born in Pakistan but for different reason. There you would not have dared to write something like this. Why have you differentiated between Pakistanis and their political establishment.. are they really separate ? If, Yes then who is BULLY, Indians or Indian political establishment or India as a whole? I hope u understand WHAT I MEAN ? Para 2 : It is not in common sense to go to third party for meadiation.Reason ? I don't want to go. Simple. But why ? That is not profitable for me. Kashmir is important for India and Indians. Natural beauty aside it's of strategic importance from military point of view. We are able to keep a watch on our not-so-friendly neighbours. Indian didn't go Uncle Bill for help during Kargil. It was our dear Nawaj.If u remember well, Uncle Bill has invited Poet Vajpayee, but Kaviraj refused. Clinton did not forced paki's retreat from Kargil but urged, on their behalf, to forgive them and give then the safe passage. Call Kashmir double standard or anything, it is perfectly right to care for your own well being first, then for others. We are no Mahatma. INDIA never gave support to LTTE. If they were being trained on Indian soil, that was not with the permission of Indian Union government. I would ask a question, Why India went to fight LTTE in 1987 and suffered the loss of more than 1100 soldiers, if they were suppoting the LTTE ? and, why did LTTE Kill Rajiv Gandhi ? Para 3: Kashmir is central for Pakistani establishment as it is necessary for their survival. Kashmir becomes central for world community when they want to put pressure on us. India doesn't have such compulsions, hence it is not central for us. Again a question, why Colin Powell changes his tune when in India ? Is America scared of us ? They do what they feel is important for them. Para 4 : Bullshit to Musharraf announcements. Have you checked whether that hyped-BAN is effective on ground ? So many Pakistani leaders have made so many announcements in past but what happened ... NOTHING. Present day Paki leaders don't respect the agreements/documents signed by their own people. Ex:- Simla and Lahore. Why should we trust Mushi-the Kargil man, the same man who refused to salute Vajpayee, the leader of India. Para 5 : Tell me how many times India has attacked its dear small neighbour. Instead, we have granted pardon everytime DEAR SMALL NEIGHBOUR pinched/poked us. They will face the results of what they do. For me there is no difference between ordinary Pakis and their leadership, just like there is no difference between Indians and their government for other countries. Para 6 : We are nobody to bother for Pakis. They will have change their face themselves. Who created ISI, who created Jihadis(Read Terrorists), do you mean Paki citizens are not responsible ? If I assume that India created LTTE and later lost control then India had to pay a heavy price. Similarily Pakis will have to pay for losing control. Para 7: No comments on 'Sant' matter as it has several different angels. Conclusion : If Pakis find India more prosperous and are not able to find any green other than their flag then they will themselves have to look into the things. They will have ask themselves.. WHY ? If they resolve to really come out of blues and with honesty, India will be first to help but a question will remain there ? How should WE trust THEM ? Shashi 31jan@indiatimes.com |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 97 of 377 ) Shashi71, no amount of logic will influence a bitch like anita pratap. she is corrupt and angling for a jobn on CNN again. she has to show her secular credentials. nothing better can be expected from prostitute journalists. even ordinary street rundis gave their blood for jawans and donated money. those street rundis have more brains than these journalist rundis like anita pratap, vinod mehta, praful bidwai, kuldip nayyar etc. God save our country from these traitorous madarchots. |
|
ap 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 98 of 377 ) If Pak wants Kashmir or Any other Indian Land It will get its next defeat in WAR. There is no way India will give any land to Pak . BTW India has 120 million muslims outside Kashmir in India . Too darn bad if it is not convinent for the pak appeasement mongers, India is not going to derail itself from secular democratic path to "help" Mushrraf or whoever the Pak dictator of the month may be. If US does not realise that it will just have to speed up its understanding process till it gets it. Kashmir issue will be resolved by settling Indians from other parts in Kashmir valley not creating seperation basis or any other way, key is assimilation. Promoting Islamic theoracies is a bad idea , just aint going to happen at Indias expense. |
|
hihary 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 99 of 377 ) My reactions to Ms. Pratap's artice is that She has aquirred greatly the "Firang" Journalistic quality of selective memory. I wont even dare to mention where she got them from. By the way if you look at journalists in U.S they behave like lawyers, jurors, judges and executioners all wrapped into one mold. The very arguement of third party mediation do not fit into the Indian mode of thinking. For once when did we ever invite a guy down the street if we have differences with our neighbours!! Ms. Pratap, One question for you. I believe the whole mess is created by a 3rd party and how do u guarantee that the 3rd party will not mess up again!!!! |
|
Chand1 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 100 of 377 ) The point is more fundamental. Imperfect though it may be, secular democracy in India is real. And Pakistan is neither secular, nor democratic. Freedom to deny freedom to others based on religion, ethnicity, language, cannot be tolerated. In the very least, constitutionally, India tries to practice secular democracy. In Pakistan on the other hand, the reflexive ethos is against secularism and against democracy. India cannot allow this system to survive next door to India. It is not being a bully to work towards bringing in freedom, democracy and secularism to Pakistan, even if it becomes an imperfect freedom and secularism at first. The process can start with liberating the Pakistan Occupied Kashmir. It is Pakistan itself, that is the problem. Once again, freedom to deny freedom has to be defeated. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 101 of 377 ) Chand1, great thoughts. people like anita pratap are corrupt. good point. i fully support your views. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 102 of 377 ) Traitors like anita pratap need to be dragged out on the street and then shot in public. She OPENLY takes the pakistani view point, even when there is much available evidence that India is the victim here. This bitch Anita Pratap needs to be gang raped and shot. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 103 of 377 ) thanks karapall for your excellent critique. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 104 of 377 ) anita pratap thinks that by suggesting mediation she is sucking two dicks at one time - americas and pakistans. that way she can get her CNN job back more easily. this bitch is a fucking joke. |
|
ap 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 105 of 377 ) If Pak wants Kashmir or Any other Indian Land It will get its next defeat in WAR. There is no way India will give any land to Pak . BTW India has 120 million muslims outside Kashmir in India so muslims in kashmir are not anything diffrent. US , UN or media are better off spinning that sooner than latter. Too darn bad if it is not convinent for the pak appeasement mongers, India is not going to derail itself from secular democratic path to "help" Mushrraf or whoever the Pak dictator of the month may be. If US does not realise that it will just have to speed up its understanding process till it gets it. Kashmir issue will be resolved by settling Indians from other parts in Kashmir valley not creating seperation basis or any other way, key is assimilation. Promoting Islamic theoracies is a bad idea anywhere, just aint going to happen at Indias expense. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 106 of 377 ) The first thing this cretin Anita Pratap needs to do is read up on history before she recommends "third party" mediation (which is exactly what the pakis want). Pakistan is a strategically located piece of land and the western powers would like to stay in this region for access to central asian oil. So,in the event of any third party mediation, Indians can be cocksure that the Americans will recommend that India "solve" this problem by handing over kashmir to pakistan. After all, the US could care less if kashmir belonged to India or pakistan, as long as UNOCAL gets to build a pipeline through pakistan and afghanisthan from the caspian sea. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 107 of 377 ) Not to mention that all the third-parties from the time of the british have ALWAYS made things difficult for India, EVEN WHEN they had full knowledge that pakistan is the intransigent one in this case. The bottomline is that India must take care of its own interests, even if traitorous whores like Anita Pratap try to sell pakistani interests to Indians. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 108 of 377 ) What is even funnier about this cretinous whore anita pratap is the her claim that she speaks for the "silent majority". All the opinion polls show HUGE support for solving the paki problem, especially in the regions closest to the paki border (they get hurt the most). Of course, this whore of a journalist, Anita Pratap, would rather sing pakistan's line to the Indians than understand the problem India is facing. Anita Pratap should pull her head out of her anus sometime and read up papers on www.saag.org , especially the intelligence reports. She should also pay attention to the pakis at www.defencejournal.com to see how her views coincide with that of the paki leadership. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 109 of 377 ) There is a recent paper in the SAAG (SOuth Asia Nalaysis Groups) that analyses why people like Anita Pratap are dangerous to Indian interests, especially in perilous times. Anita has no clue on the fundamentals of foreign politics: SELF INTEREST. Note how the US openly behaves in a hypocritical way in this war against terror, because it does not care if it appears hypocritical as long as it gets the job done by hook or by crook. Also, note the total confluence of views in the US media that projects their interests first. Cretins like Ms. Pratap need to pay alot more attention before they palm off their ignorant nonsense as valid views on foreign policy. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 110 of 377 ) bravo karapall, well written counter to that tariatorous whore pratap. viva karapall. |
|
thetruth 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 111 of 377 ) Always there were wicked people everywhere. Anita Pratap is one of them. We cannot do anything about it. So , leave her alone. People like Anita Pratap wants international recognition,She won't think the way a patriotic Indian will think( Anitaji may call them FASCIST,JINGOIST though she is not qualified to label anyone) .She will not write about the KASHMIRI HINDU PANDITS , they are communal refugees for her.If Anita Pratap says "People should be real motherfuckers" what kind of criticism she can expect ?? Definitely , there is limit we should not cross,this applicable to our Anita Madam also . But India is a soft state, Anitaji can spit venom against India ,drink liquors peacefully in Norway....I SAY AGAIN , IF SHE WERE IN CHINA , SHE WOULD HAVE BEEN PUNISHED SUITABLY. |
|
Tathagat 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 112 of 377 ) appa DeepO bhava ...3rd party mediation is not a matter of pride for india but just one of the tricks... but2continue2hold on2Kashmir by force... occupation... not2resolve the conflict [which has cost both these countries hoondreds of thousands crores on weapon and stupid wars...] while hundreds of thousands of school... lack basic furnitures... [this country looks ooogly and disgustingly poor... ] -2keep postponding it like a tenant does... using every trick in the bag2retain his/her possession...2 do time it is not just doooble standard it is clear dhoort'ta... giant trickster... sure it is... Paakisstaan is progressing under a modern, progressive polished leader while India will keep b'coming a bigger n bigger bhaiNse ka tabailaa day by day... women can see truth and pragmatic enuff2ooonderstand the reality... and have the guts2say it... no matter what only the last time round this technology wasn't around... also all their slander and venome reflects on them... tathagat was angry when u called Pokhran II as 'accomplishment'4 India... wrong analysis Vishnu Khare... Opinion - News Analysis : Star wars : Vishnu Khare... [can't include the url here coz the Hindu change the url the next day... Sonia has met and shook hands of more HOSs and PMs than U and the ruling baanar sena have known 2 be ever there... buffoon u think u r pretty smart... let tathagat tell u... u r NOT... u also think u are secular and a non partisan... but u r biased... and Atom Bomb hindu fundamentalist Vajpaayii is wrong when he chides... zaraa opposition meiN baithna seekhye... INC [i wonder why these madraasies still call INC as Cong(I)] is 116+ year old party... and has been in opposition more than in the govt.,... even indian media is full bhaiNse ka tabelaas... being president of INC is no lessor than PM... get it... nah u guys are too thick... 2 effing arrogant2realize that u are all baabooo chapraasies laboring for dalla baniya baipaari... lol... baajpaayii is a pigmy... bigoted idiot... and ugly at that... who could barely walk... or even talk... but sure he knows the laffaazie but apparently his brain so slow at it now... glad both Laaloo and Aar Paar Bhaajpaayii talked of bhaiNse... both reckoning buffalo milk more nourishing... thank u Mehta/ Illaiah/tathagat 2 bring the poor buffalo mainstream... :) e2e [edited, spellchecked ;), updated Feb 25th 9:45 PM] |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 113 of 377 ) imbeciles like tathagat need to undrerstand that if India does not protect itself from external aggression, not only will we not solve all the problems India faces, but we will also lose all of our assets and our freedom as a people. Unless tathagat is a bonafide paki, he would think twice about disrespecting the wonderful job our army and government is currently doing with respect to pakistan. |
|
ulmo3 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 114 of 377 ) I have been going over the list of responses to the article and it seems people are more interested in calling names, shouting and screaming. To those people I would quote Thomas Jefferson on what is the essence of democracy. When talking to his opponent he said "Sir, I do not agree with what you say but I will fight till my last breath for your right to say it". That in a nut shell is democracy. Its a mans right to say what he believes in and that is his fundamental right in a democratic nation. If people believe that it is high time that we should let Kashmir go they have a right to say it because we are not in a dictatorship and they have a right. You may not agree with that and you have a right to state your views. Shouting , Heckling, Abusing those people just shows bad manners. I hope people will allow everyone express their views, whether they like it or not and not pass personal comments. India is not the fiefdom of one set of people or one set of views and I hope we are civilised enough to conduct a dialogue. |
|
sandy69 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 115 of 377 ) I find it very surprising that we even consider third party mediation for a dispute with a nation that is like an ant compared to our elephantile size, strength and resources. Hence we should now go in for a bit more extreme measures to perhaps make Pak understand the futility of crying over srilt milk, in this case read as " Kashmir". If things go worse let the soldiers do the talking and all will be sorted out.... |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 116 of 377 ) ulmo3, Your pea-sized brain seems to have missed the obvious as usual. The issue is not "free speech", as in speaking the enemy's point of view during times of war. The issue is writing about foreign policy issues with maturity and with the backing of facts. Given pakistan's track record of terrorism, betrayal, and plain bare-faced lying, only imbeciles like Anita Pratap, and cretins like you who confuse free speech with irresponsible journalism would find something wrong with India's escalation on the Pak border. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 117 of 377 ) ulmo3, The heckling and the abuse is in connjunction with normal reasoning, so stuff your concern for bad language up your nether end if you cannot defend the indefensible. |
|
Tathagat 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 118 of 377 ) appa DeepO bhava pay back time... 4 she is a woman, and can't git down 2 ur level... u Karapal and luwmann... though u all cannot be reasoned with ...closed minded ill informed hate ridden hindu tolaibaaN... You uncultured assortment of noxious cow cud u gaay chodooo plague spreading flea... [Thou art] like the toad, ugly and venomous gaay chodoooz, You inhuman accumulation of cheesy cow pies. .. gaay chodooo You inhuman crate of rotten donkey droppings on2 a holy cow. You feeble-minded pile of second-hand dirty underwear. You unwelcome bucket of fornicating maggot fodder. You brainless container of nauseating swine remains. Thou whoreson impudent embossed rascal! You insane barrel of septic tripe u gaaychod. Thou puny tickle-brained horn-beast! Thou loggerheaded fen-sucked foot-licker! You dreadful sack of grimy leprosy scabs. You ugly accumulation of gruesome lark's vomit. Is that enuff guys?!? or u think they deserve more... :) |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 119 of 377 ) tathagat, Your insults still need a lot of work. Most of them are downright praises, if one reads them right... Paki loving pieces of human excrement like yourself probably have a hard time trying to figure out why being patriotic and supporting the country's interests SIDE BY SIDE with your ideological foes is essential. Here is a clue: read on the definition of modern statehood and the rights and responsibilities as a citizen of a given state (such as India or any other democracy). Worthless imbeciles like you should pay more attention instead of trying to gain attention by your brainless, worthless, commie, anti-national rhetoric. |
|
cecil 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 120 of 377 ) For every day that India and Pakistan hurl accusations against each other, each alleging that the other is not trustworthy, prejudicial attitudes get reinforced and regional cooperation becomes a distant if not remote possibility. Mediation might help the two nations actually listen to each other and begin the longer and more difficult process of establishing and maintaining peace rather than threatening war. The focus of both nations should be progress in the region for their citizens -- Not immature displays of military might or jaundiced statements about each others countries. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 121 of 377 ) cecil, you are an imbecile if you think you can compare pakistan with india. pakistan is an illegal hateful entity creating trouble. india is at the receiving end buddy. what has US mediation done in Israel and Palstine, NOTHING. The US is interested in Kashmir for its own purposes and is not the right forum. the only solution is the elimination of pakistans hate mentality. the problem here is not kashmir but muslim communalism. if kashmir is given to pakistan (this will never happen) they will find another excuse to fight with india. while your intentions may be good MEDIATION is the last thing that will solve the kashmir problem. |
|
Calive 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 122 of 377 ) I agree with the anita pratap"s opinion that India is playing dual role. One one hand she wants to settle all disputes with Pakistan amicablly through peaceful negotations, but on the other, she is saying that Kashmir shall not be included in the talks. Anita pratap shall take less salt as she is an Indian girl and the hypertension is a brutal disease. Anita pratap always tried to be oversmart by trying to hook herself and have visionary illusions. I suggest she must take rest on a hill top for a fortnight so that her ideas may rejuvenate. |
|
Calive 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 123 of 377 ) Being a journalist also, my individual view point is that India should shun the adamant attitude and come to the negotiating table by inviting other two main allies viz Pakistan and Kashmir and settle all disputes in the light of Simla Agreement, Lahore Declaration and Tashkant Agreement and as per UN resolutions. THE Adamant attitude of India that Kashmir is its integral part is a big mistake for it. India has forgotten that it separated East Pakistan, now Bangaldesh from Pakistan. And the Pakistan is now retaliating and trying to separate Kashmir. Anita Pratap shall take in mind that the scholars ink is more sacred that the blood of the martyr. So she shall use her ink bravely and courageously without any fear. Afterall she is a writer (Indian) |
|
Calive 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 124 of 377 ) Anita Pratap sitting in the drawing room in Delhi do not know and feel the heat of paradise, the fragrance of saffron and the cool breeze of the high mountains. She does not know the pain of the ordinary people in the vale. She does not know the meaning of the words - crackdown, cross firing, seige, third degree torture, shrieks of the youth in the interrogation centers. She can only imagine these. if she had would have faced these, she would have known the taste of it. The soil of the vale is now red as it soaked the blood of three lakh people. the graveyards are full. the hearts of the people are so much terrorised as they used to bolt thier doors at 6 in the eveing and a slow knock increased the heart palpitation and the blood pressure shoots very high. The children are so scared that they used to off the lights of their bedrooms very early. I suggest, Anita Pratap shall visit the vale then write. If she dares. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 125 of 377 ) Indians have been killed by paki terrorists on a regular basis, and is that no sufficient evidence for you that Pakistan cannot claim to be friendly and export terror to India simultaneously. Simple enough, expect maybe for the cretins in the Indian press. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 126 of 377 ) Anita Pratap deserves to be gang raped and shot for supporting the enemy point of view at this time. The enemy Pakistan is clever enough to know that if they can trick India to the table, then they can pretend to talk to India while disavowing themselves of all terror that they create in India.....this tactic has been used in the 1990-1996 period. Whores like Anita Pratap and cretins who think that she is a misunderstood patriot need to get a clue on why the Indian government has its current attitude with pakistan, instead of speaking through their nether end. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 127 of 377 ) Calive, i dont know what you are fucking saying. anita pratap is a cock sucking bitch. devoid of any sense. she is sucking muslim dick and american dick to get a job somewhere, i am sure. most indian journalists are prostitutes. actually prostitutes are better, they provide a useful service. indian journalists are pig shit eating worms devoid of principle. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 128 of 377 ) Calive, let me tel you something. there will be no mediation in kashmir or elsewhere. it is time india thrashes pakistan and eliminates it from the map. peace will automatically result from this. what are you talking about bangladesh. there the pakistani sadists murdeed millions of muslims and hindus. india rescued those ungrateful muslim bastardfs in bengal. along with their communist brethen in calcutta these bangali scum are the worst kind of animals. maybe we should have let the pakistanis kill all of those motherfuckers along with jyothi basu and his stinking communist shit eating animals. |
|
Calive 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 129 of 377 ) Luwmann: I may advise you here that you may desist from using abusive language for a writer like Anita Pratap. Afterall Anita Pratap is an Indian girl and showed patriotism, just like other national papers did. they cannot dare to writer a word against India then they have to close their shops here. As the freedom of expression in India is one of the basic rights. But just like democracy, this is confined to papers only. Regarding the shooting up of the blood pressure of Anita Pratap. I had already conveyed her just to spend a fortnight on any hill station so that her B.P. level will come down. I just advise her to go to the burning vale of Kashmir and listen there the miseries of the general masses so that while sitting in her drawing room and writing something, she can put forward the pains and miseries of the people of Kashmir through her columns. I think the clouds of nuclear war are spreading throughout indo-pak border and the day will come soon when both the countries will be destroyed and US would occupy the land. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 130 of 377 ) Anita Pratap is no more Indian than Pervez Musharraf...After all they seem to have similar points of view... |
|
Phoenix 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 131 of 377 ) there will be no war. "calvin" you are out of your mind. there will only be war iff pakistan initiates it. it has always been that way. haven't you read your non-propoganda-paki history books? |
|
Phoenix 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 132 of 377 ) a fatwah should be issues by india for anita pratap, for treason and conspiracy against the state!! as a citizen i demand this fatwah!!! |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 133 of 377 ) Phoenix for president. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 134 of 377 ) calive, that bitch anita pratap does not deserve to be abused , she should be shot for treason. |
|
topcat 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 135 of 377 ) South India should secede! The North Indian states are riddled with fanatics and criminals in politics. These states have lowest human development indicators in the country while the southern states(Kerala, Andhra, Tamil Nadu and Karnataka) have the highest. Problems such as killing of Sikhs, Muslims, Ayodhya, Kashmir, Pakistan, China, Assam which are bleeding the country arise because of the stupid barabrians living in the North Indian states. The Southern states have for 50 years ended up using their resources to pull these North Indians heads out of their asses. Now it looks like that is not going to happen. So the only alternative available to the four Southern states is to form a separate confedaration and secede from India. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 136 of 377 ) topcat, stop your fucking bullshit. there is no truth to your rantings about the north. it is not true that the southern states are doing better than the north. maharashtra, gujarat, punjab, haryana are the top states in india economically. then karnataka AP and TN are doing fairly well. the hindi heartland is the one that suffered the most from invasions, hence they are a little backward. the east is ravaged by ethnic, muslim, and communist insurgency. the fact is no one can crow about anything in india south or north. the real reason for backwardness is the wrong policies of the congress party and its clones over the past 50 years. nothing to do with north and south. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 137 of 377 ) topcat, i am not from the north or the south. i consider myself to be an indian, period. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 138 of 377 ) luwmann, Given that the Indian hindus are a worthless bunch of snotbags who would rather try to kiss muslim ass out of fear rather than speak out for what's right, I think topcat's contention is an admirable one. Break up India, and the hindus will get a small country that they can then develop at a faster rate than with all these muslim deadweights hanging around India's neck. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 139 of 377 ) karapall, topcats views are extremely dangerous. it is dravidian nonsense. i have heard it before. i for one do not accept a smaller india. we need to be very careful. the south has progressed marginally better over the past 30 years because of two things. central govt. investment (major industries were located in hyderabad and bangalore) as they were away from china and pakistan. the northwest of the country punjab, sindh, maharashtra, gujrat was traditionally better off tah rest of the country. that is why pakistans per capita income was always more than india's. leaving that aside topcats assertions are childish. sikhs are a brave people who have given their blood to defend others. they are the single most important and vibrant part of indian society. the fcat that some of them have been misled mainly due to congress opportunism is another matter. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 140 of 377 ) how long with a smaller india be insulated from the goings on around it (hypothetical). percentage wise there are more muslims in kerala and andhra pradesh than many northern states. it is 20% in kerala and rabidly communal. they even wanted to be part of pakistan in 1947. it is foolish to think that muslims in the south are any more sane than muslims elsewhere. their thinking is identical. look at bangla, is it really any different from pakistan. not really. infact, bangla is causing more havoc in india than pakistan is. the entire northeast is being converted into a muslim majority area by bangladesh silent invasion. the south of india should fight shoulder to shoulder with their northern brothers to eradicate the ills that face the country. china , pakistan, muslim communalism are a threat to all (north south east and west). topcat is ajuvenile dravidian nationalist. they are traitors. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 141 of 377 ) karapall, i agree that many hindus are what you described them to be. that is our fate. what can be done about it. |
|
Phoenix 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 142 of 377 ) Thanks luwman, I would love to be president of this rotting country and bring some good fucking changes |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 143 of 377 ) phoenix, yes india is rotting. thanks to our secularists who really are hindu haters and communists. it is still not fully lost. the BJP was a ray of hope but that has fallen by the wayside. maybe, a political polarisation may take place after a lot of bloodshed. wars always create new beginnings. i am convinced that the BJP is finished thanks to Vajpayee and clan. A new party is now required. let us see what happens. |
|
joy 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 144 of 377 ) Luv bhai, you are our only hope now that this compromiser-in-chief Vajpayee is kissing, no licking, Mohammedan ass . You are our new vaseline-deficient phallic machine. |
|
somnath4 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 145 of 377 ) I have some times wondered why is the Kashmir issue a bilateral one, is it because we have an old colonial hangover of partition or we love to sweep all our problems under the carpet and dig our head in the sand. May be itżs the both, cos we sure cant trust our neighbors to mediate in some thing as `sensitiveż as Kashmir. So what we do, we let in Uncle Sam through the back door, who tell us in just as many words żż start the dialogues NOW, choose you want to go to the negotiating table smiling or we drag you kicking and screaming.żż And guess why is Uncle Sam so eager to broker peace in the subcontinent? You think they are here to save the world and donżt want us third world natives to play with nukes and want to see our children get education and our women get healthcare; then I must say that you are suffering from a illusion of a delusion. All uncle Sam is aiming is the oil in the Caspian sea and its access from any where not just to quench its ever increasing energy needs, but also any other industry that its going to set up in the Indian western coast, in which America has controlling interests. Thatżs why they have set out to see we donżt play with nukes and practice war rhetoric by keeping mum from mussruff referendum to any excesses committed by the Indian military in the valley. All they are looking for is the oil and gas pipeline to flow and the whole region falls under there dictate. The beginning has been pretty good the axis of evil has included Iran, permanent presence in Afghanistan and Pakistan and all energy using factories in the western coast of India. Itżs an amazing enterprise that they want to run, and we are just a clog in the whole machine, of this amazing WORLD ENTERPRISE. This is unfortunately the package that we are sold to and is moving towards at break neck speed . This not only gives uncle Sam a permanent toehold in the region it also negates our options of dealing with some one else cos if we ever try to be naughty to our beloved uncle the taps will be turned off and our business will undergoe energy starved death. But I still think there is time for the sanity to return, we not only need a third party meditation in the Kashmir issue but we need some one from Asia to do it who is preferably a party to it too. Some one like china, some one Pakistanis trusts and some one who has akshichien under its control. As we slide towards a inevitable war with Pakistan and uncle Samżs back door diplomacy in this matter will be as disastrous as there middle east one. Think we should ask the dragon to take a look at our problem, who knows we three might just get married and live happily ever after amen. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 146 of 377 ) somnath4, Firstly, have a little more respect in yourself and your country. No third party, including the almight uncle sam, can do ANYTHING to force India to act against its own interests. Secondly, kashmir has always been a lightning rod for the pakistani elite who have been ruling the country since independence. They have been brainwashing their children for many decades on how "hindu banias" (always this phrase) are untrustworthy mongrels who must wiped off the face of this planet. Thus, not only the elite but also the common man in pakistan HATES EVERY INDIAN (who they see as hindu) to the CORE. Given these circumstances do you think it is wise to engage the pakis?? The paki bastards have always followed the following strategy: (1) ask for "talks" with India (2) once India agrees, make sure that the talks go nowhere by being obstinate and completely unreasonable (the typical paki demand is that the kashmir problem can be "solved" only by handing all of it to pakistan) (3) while they claim to be "talking" to India, they send in more islamic jihadi terrorist scumbags across the border to kill Indians and ethnically cleanse J&K of all non muslims. (4) All the while, they are on PR overdrive all over the world, where they show photographs of terrorists eliminated by Indian forces as the photographs of "innocent civilians" or even worse they show photos of the terrorist's victims and claim that it was an act by Indian forces (as in chattisingpora). (5) The stupid bastards in the Indian media suck up all the brayings of these pakis and refuse to believe the Indian govt.'s stance that the Indian army is a professional army that does not hurt innocents. So for starters, stop paying attention to the worthless bastards in the Indian media, at least on this issue. In fact, these very same bastards used to call pakistani jihadi terrorists as "kashmiri militants" FOR THE PAST DECADE, thereby undermining the interests of India and Indians on this kashmir issue. Such is the "patriotism" of the Indian journalists and news editors. |
|
Viper 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 147 of 377 ) NO, I don't think there should be 3rd party mediation between India and Pakistan. You don't know the intentions and any decision against any party will be taken badly and not accepted. India before partition has seen enough mediation. Result: PARTITION! |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 148 of 377 ) Who are these secularist?.. I am shocked by the barbarity of Gujarat and suddenly my views are Secular? I would like to see every person in India live freely, healthily and happily and I am a godamed secularist. There are two factions here - Blustering yet dangerous inhuman people and decent yet a little confused sensible people. The objective is to solve a problem Period. We are never going to nuke the Pakis becase we will get screwed too. We can talk about war because its not out brothers/sisters dying (They are in US as s/w engineers or studying for MS) but some poor f$%&rs who have no other option to join the army. If third party mediation can solve the problem then so be it. Does some one loose his honour by trying to make people lives better? |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 149 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron Gandalf, Thanks for speaking from your ass.Well your handle says it all that your mouth is in the vicinity of your nether end. Let me remind you butthead that we are discussing about Third part mediation and not your Secular thoughts.If you want to post anymore messages about the hindu barbarians then use the Back button on the browser and search for the topic Riots After Riots.You can scream your lungs out there. Now let me have the honour of beating the shit out of you. To be frank I dont know where to start from, not because I am falling short of intelligence but you are excreta right from top to toe. OK,let me pick up the least stinking part of all. QUOTE (They are in US as s/w engineers or studying for MS) UNQUOTE Ok,scumbag,everybody cannot join the Army to fight on the border. You contribute to the development of your country in various ways.BROTHERS AND SISTERS(Read Sabir Bhatia,Rono Dutta et all)donate big money to their Alma Mater's back home (Read " IIT's and Pilani's).Other lesser known BROTHERS AND SISTERS contribute dollars as NRI savings or SMALL donations for relief work,which to a SMALL extent keep their homeland going. QUOTE poor f$%&rs UNQUOTE Good to know that you hold people who protect our borders in such high esteem.Gadhe ke lund,realise that if they dont do their work then you will be a ghulam to a Paki or a chinese. QUOTE We are never going to nuke the Pakis becase we will get screwed too UNQUOTE You stink but there is a a valid point in what you said.Yes we will not nuke Pakistan.The reason for that is not that we fear our partioned(Your's not mine)BROTHER'S and SISTER'S but that the Indian thought process is much more advanced than their counterparts across the border.If we nuke and they nuke back then we will write away a decade of development.If that happens then your noble thought QUOTE I would like to see every person in India live freely UNQUOTE will be defeated. Looks like the Government of India does not want to hurt your sentiment.Ofcourse,how can it do something like that. You are the harbinger of the new secular India. By the way how old are you? I may give some concession depending upon how young you are! |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 150 of 377 ) Dear Fellow Indians, Michael Krepon is the same buttmunch who supported economic sanctions on India after the nuclear tests, and openly claimed that Indians are incapable of handling nukes, and now Outlook would like us to listen to this bastard on why we should talk to pakistan, when the pakistanis are openly hostile to India. If anyone sees this bastard Michael Krepon in India, make sure you spit in his general direction. The question we need to ask ourselves is "why is Outlook India providing propaganda space to foreigners who are clearly against Indian interests?" Again, this is just another small contribution for the progress of India made by this traitorous asshole Vinod Mehta. I am sure he will contribute much more in the same vein... |
|
Emthree 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 151 of 377 ) 3/17/2002 11:12:31 PM ( # 2 of 2 ) Yaar pyar badhao tum log. Ram to limitless hain. Ram kahin national boundaries mante hain kya? Apna spiritual horizon badhao - ye national border expand karke kys phayda? Borrowed from Joy. I like it, that's why! Emthree |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 152 of 377 ) anand, thanks for putting this hijda gandalf in his place, which is the shit pot. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 153 of 377 ) Lowman, Kalupal and anda.. are you by anychance out-of-work software engineers?. One fool run short of intellignece, the other fools got a rabid fear of upstaged by Pakis (were you the class idiot by any chance or did people make fun of you /your mom constantly) Hoo Haa young men ...lets get the testosterone up lets spit at everyone we dont like (hilarious Karpal.. how does your Daddy allow you to play with the comp). One juvenile is kicked about some contributions to IIT.. Hahaha do you know that Chinese diaspora have invested 140 times what that indian Diaspora have done.. SORRY I did not include the BJP/RSS/Bajrang Dal contributions.. it may even up then.. Friends I suggest you dont involve yourseld in these matters ... read your 'java for dummies' and get saome job some where. Ta! |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 154 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron Gandalf, Congratulations.I appreciate your acting prowess.How easily you put aside the topic of discussion and got down to personal mud slinging.By the way,can you express your visesh tippani on how posting 20+ messages does not account for a jobless state but posting 6+ does.Dont exert pressure on your knees.You will end up with a migrane. God knows what brought you to the conclusion that we trio are computer programmers. I had addressed you as Gadhe ke lund,sorry for that.Dont blush ratshit, the sorry is because I brought disrepute to a donkey.Tu to us se bhi gaya guzra hai. Next time you post a message scratch your ass read hard.The heat generated may fuel your knee and hopefully you may come up with something meaningful. By the way,Gandhi ke puttar,I am exhibiting the "no anger" and "non violence" policy here and you are the one who is getting personal and profane.Are we talking about MK Gandhi ??? To put it succinctly,I pity you and your existance.A quick question GANDalf,which software do you use to browse the internet.I know someone who works with mentally challenged children.She was interested in knowing of any software,those kids could use to work their way through the internet.Do I suggest "Java for Dummies". Bache tujhe dua denge GANDalf One last question.If everything is Gand then from where do you eat? Am I guessing it right??? Ha, Ha,Ho,Ho,Ho. Need to go.I have to use YOU to pass my stools Eagerly awaiting your visesh tippani |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 155 of 377 ) We shall overcome. India and Pakistan are like two quarrelling brothers who take one another for granted. The only see the bad in one another and not the good. The economic benefits that their people can realise if they were at peace. When things like this happen, Papa Sam or Mom Britannia have to step in and help the "young" nations sort out their differences and be normal. Perhaps a spank on the butt of both nations will teach them a lesson too. |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 156 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron jbindra, You are right.We need Uncle Sam to sought out our differences with Pakistan.I am sure that America will pull us out of this trouble as effectively as it is solving the present Israel-Palestine problem.By the way there is a voting campaign for next years Noble Peace Prize.We are all voting for Colin Powell.Please cast your vote at www.vote_an_impotent.com. Dont worry,we will vote for him again when Pakistan takes Kashmir and another 50,000 are killed. Please keep posting such messages.Mis guided youth like me will get some direction and resolve. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 157 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Anand : Agreed that the US isnt the best mediator, but dont you think we need someone to bring the two to the talking table, talk about the issues that they hold against one another and sort them out. Right now we're just threatening one another and this way there definitely wont be any peace. Lets just make a start and hopefully if everyone acts in a sane minded way, we will resolve everything. What say you ? Better to make a start somewhere with someone, or just to wait for God to sort out matters for us ? |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 158 of 377 ) jbindra, either you are a dreaming moron or a stupid imbecile or both. there is nothing to sort out with pakistan. the motherfuckers are a bunch of hateful bastards who need to be taught a lesson that they will never forget. india should never have recognized the existance of pakistan. fuck the bastards and take military action. the sooner the better. as for your mediation by other countries, all i can say is you are a dumbshit.the mediators will only want an independent kashmir so that they can set up their bases there. fuck mediation. fuck talks. take military action. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 159 of 377 ) jbindra: "Agreed that the US isnt the best mediator, but dont you think we need someone to bring the two to the talking table, talk about the issues that they hold against one another and sort them out." That would depend on what the position of Pakistan, would it not? you stupid cretin. Pakistan is STILL openly hostile to India, as can be seen from their refusal to hand over Indian criminals under the protection of the pakistani government BACK TO INDIA and their continued infiltration of islamic jihadi pakistani terrorists into India. Have you ever conducted simple business negotiations?? Do you ever get into business with a hostile entity?? Have a little faith and pride in India and Indians before you start behaving like a pakistani and expect other people to solve your problems for you. |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 160 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron jbindra, Before I pen any further,I am sorry for being acidic in my previous postings.I would say that you are talking from your heart.Issues relating a hostile neighbour cannot be discussed on past sentiments.Here are some facts. Existance of Pakistan will be questioned if we Indians live in peace.As someone mentioned,the daily bread of the elite in Pakistan is to find ways to prove that Jinnah's two nation theory was right. Pakistan intentions in Kashmir are solely to extend its border.It cares a damn about the Kashmiri separatists. If Kashmir goes to Paksitan then you will see Yaseen Malik and company hanging to a branch in Lal Bagh or Char Chinar. About talking,there is no fun talking to them.We took the initiative to talk to them but in return we were gifted with Kargil,attack on the Parliament and bullets fired in the ear's of our soldiers caught by them in the Kargil war. The recent Israel-Palestine conflict brings to light the true American foreign policy.A kg of viagra will do no good to lift the impotent American dick.I will not be suprised if America is assisting in the present military action. I know you would want to know whats the solution.Here is what I propose. Giving the army a free hand in Kashmir Appoint KPS Gill as the Director of Police of Kashmir Appoint JagMohan as the Governer of Kashmir Make it clear to Mr Farooq Lullah that there will be no autonomy Take inspiration from Israel.Settle hardcore hindu goons in Kashmir and give them complete protection.I hope you understand what I mean. Any militant caught should be sent to (his) heaven.One way ticket to Allah ke Jannat. Ask the UN to go fuck itself when it asks for human right violations.Ask them for the Jenin camp enquiry report eveytime they ask for ours. In the meantime make India a global power that every country will recognize. India should be more presentable and welcoming to foreign investment.A strong ecomony with a say in world matters will automatically sideline Pakistan.If you feel I am talking from my ass then the example is in front of you dude.ISRAEL. All this takes a NON-secular government at the centre.So please vote for BJP.Its the most Non Secular Govt but we cannot do all the above without giving BJP complete majority.We need a glimpse of Sardar Patel to set things right in India and the only party that can repeat Razakar movement is BJP. All this takes atleast 5 years to happen.In the meantime Anita Pratap and company should be given Pakistani Dildo's to suck.It will keep their mouth and hands busy till we clean up the mess. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 161 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Anand, Karapall and Luvvmann I know that there is great patriotism amongst you fellows and I appreciate it. Pakistan is indeed the neighbour that we shouldnt have ever had. However the lasting solution is always the one that takes a moral stand and follows the path of peace. There can be no other way than to try, try again until we succeed. The position is more dangerous now as Pakistan is nuclear. We cannot simply believe that we can force it to do what we want. As far as Anand's suggestion of Hindu goons is considered. Please dont say such things it really hurts to see that fellow Indians have so much hate in them that they wish to kill their own people for a piece of land. I have volunteered with the Red Cross in Kashmir. The common man there is the same as the common man in Delhi or Nagpur. One Gujarat is enough. Hatred will beget hatred, nothing more. |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 162 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron jbindra Saab, A peaceful solution with Pakistan is what we have always desired but it has never worked out.I am not interested in taking over even an inch of Pak Zameen but if its Kashmir,they will got an inch. Peace,they kill,we peace,they kill, we peace,they kill,we peace,they kill. Got bored reading? No Sir,we talk peace only with humans not animals.Animals understand only Danda and nothing else. A word on the innocent civilians of Kashmir whom you compared to our Indian Orange city citizens of Nagpur. You said you visited Kashmir,right? Are the homes of all the hindu pandits who left kashmir locked and in the same state as they left it.Who is living in those houses? Hindu's? Muslims? Who is LIVING IN THOSE HOUSES? Why dont you feel the pain of all the Kashmiri Pandits who were kicked out of Kashmir.Please dont tell you are related to Gandhi.I mean,I have had an encounter with many and I am tired of them. Gujarat is just a start and by the way Gujarat started because of torching the train.There will be more Gujarat's if they dont fall in line. I am 26 and blood boils,ask a 50 year old displaced Kashmiri Pandit.He will give you a swift kick between your legs for talking Gandhism and related bullshit |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 163 of 377 ) jbindra, what will it take people like you to understand that peace with pakistan is not possible. if peace is established, then the very existance of pakistan seems superfluous. the only way to live with pakistan is to keep them under control. if we do not take military action they will bleed us continuously. pakistan is a hateful country that is our enemy. the bastards have caused too much harm to us. a massive military operation cutting pakistan into two or three parts is the answer. pakistan west of indus should be ceded to afghanistan. the east of the river indus should be cut up into two separate countries SINDH and MUSLIM PUNJAB. this is the only viable solution and one that india can keep an eye on. WAR is not easy, it is dificult. brave people take difficult decisions, cowards run away from making these decisions. india will pay a heavy price if we do not finish pakistan now. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 164 of 377 ) http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/MONITOR/ISSUE3-2/nar ayanan.html All you cretins who seem to be talking through your ass about kashmir should read this piece on the hizbul mujahideen's most recent peace initiative was trashed by pakistan. It would also help ignoramuses such as jbindra to go and follow the discussions in www.bharat-rakshak.com and learn some facts on both domestic and foreign policy issues. |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 165 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron Karapall, I have been trying to contact you via your email address Jkarap@home.net. Looks like the ID does not exist anymore.Please mail me your address on anandnimbalkar@hotmail.com Regards A nand |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 166 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron I mean to anandnimbalkar@hotmail.com |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 167 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Anand : I realise your point. I have indeed lived in Kashmir for 3-4 months and I feel equally for the Kashmiri people, be it Hindu, Muslim or the Buddhists. You would be surprised how many Kashmiris, irrespective of their religious affiliations want both the Pakistanis and Indians to stop playing war games on thier land, leave and simply let them live in peace. Expelling Kashmiri Pundits is equally wrong as is the expulsion of Muslims from their homes. It is very sad that our own citizens, in their own nation are internal refugees. Finally to your point of Pakistan - True our efforts have always failed. And we must learn from their trickery and be more alert when we engage them next to achieve peace. But also remember it is because of our methods of peace and restraint that the world sees India as a great democracy and Pakistan as a failed theocratic and totalitarian state. Lets not lose what we have, lets build on it and hopefully our kids will be proud that our generation corrected the wrongs of the previous and replaced hate with love and amity. btw : Gandhi was a very smart and wonderful guy, lets not villify against him. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 168 of 377 ) jbindhra, your idealistic bullshit makes me throw up. who said gandhi was not great. does that mean he was very intelligent. was he correct about the muslim menace, absolutely not. he failed miserably. what do you think we should do, leave kashmir to the wonderful kashmiris. if kashmiri muslims are so great why did they not defend the pundits. they are kashmiris too, their brothers. the fact is either we understand the nature of islam correctly and take precautions and measures to establish peace or live with violence for ever. all you are making is pious comments. what do we need to do to end the menace is the question. action is required. pakistan as a state has to be ended in it's present form. it has to be broken into several pieces so that it's mischief can be controlled. jehadi muslim terrorists should be killed, no other solution. indian laws should be made religion transparent. no religious education and parties should be allowed. population of muslims cannot be allowed to explode. they should be in line with other people. either we take pragmatic steps or we can start digging our graves right now. |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 169 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron jbindra, Let me guess.You are working either with the UN or with some Indian government representation in US. Now let me answer your questions We have a higher moral standing in the world.Allow me to laugh.Ok,I am back.Sir,who is the world according to you? Let me go by the continents. Antartica,I never heard that Penguins have opinions on morality. Yo,somebody,did I miss Nigel's Wild Life on Discovery? Australia,we are an immigration pain for them and nothing more. Asia,we are a part of them.Chinese and Pakistani's will always be against us.Russia is our friend,so will always support. Europe,I sincerely doubt if they know that we exist.All Europeans I have encountered have asked me the following questions How many elephants I have at home? Do I know the rope trick? Man,if they know something about Indian morality then I have met idiots South America, Do I need to say something? Africa, jingala ho,jingala ho.Never heard anything beyond that America, Hey we are expecting a lot from them if we talk about morality. Now you tell me Bindra Saab,who the fuck cares about our democracy and our opinions.War on terrorism.Ghanta war on terrorism.Nothing more but bullshit. Pakistan as a failed theocratic and totalitarian state Are you hibernating or what? Here try this.A little vodka with orange juice + crushed ice.Give it a bottoms up.That should give you a kick.By morning you will be fine.Read the newspapers and tell me what YOUR WORLD had to say about Musharraf's coming to power. Saviour of democracy did not condemn a military rulers self appointment? Either I am missing something or you are beyond what I can comprehend. Lets cut a deal.Post something concrete with proof and I will reply. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 170 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Anand : Your post was most amusing. I am sure your literary talent is not confined to this board alone. However, lets begin with identifying issues that India and Pakistan have between them and then we can talk about each of them. Kashmir : My solution is to accept the current borders as territorial boundaries "in-situ" and quit all other propoganda. Terrorism : Having worked in Kashmir, I know that there are two kinds, the one that comes from jehadi fanatics trained in Pakistan etc and that which the security forces inflict on the populace. Both exist and both must stop post haste. Also, no terrorism from hardline groups like VHP, BD or RSS should be instigated. Rehabilitation : Displaced communities must be resettled, given subsidies and loans to restart businesses and return to a normal life. These are the basic ones. Once these are accomplished, then the following must be implemented. Withdrawl of Forces : This must be effected in non-border areas. As of now, the population of the Indian troops exceeds half that of local Kashmiris. Withdrawl of Special Status : In reality J&K needs no special status as it will never be a autonomous state again. The idea then was to have it like China has Hong Kong. But we have altered the ground realities so much that the law exists only on paper. So let it lapse and the so called nationalists be pleased. Finally; India and Pakistan sit on the table and start CBMs once and for all. We need to transform South Asia to a union like the EU to counter China and ASEAN. I am sure if we decide to resolve things, we will be the best region of the world in a few decades. Its's hard, takes hard decisions, takes sacrifices, but the benefits are immense and its not a job for all talkers and no do-ers, but for well meaning rational and astute people who are willing to give the other a square and move a square forward themself. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 171 of 377 ) Jbindra: extremely coherent and valid suggestions. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 172 of 377 ) Lowman, k and anda.. why dont you creat another ID as your fourth persona so you can abuse each other. And anand, just because every european who looked at you asked you about elephants does not mean that you have to be so bitter. Poor boy.. I guess you are going through a testosterone high which will stabilize when you reach 25. |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 173 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron gandalf, Thats enough.I cannot take your modesty anymore.How many times do you want me to feel bad that you are a moron. You little skunk,I am 26 and age doesnt reverse.Write something meaningful if you want to be noticed and read and if all this is to get me wild,dude,you will have to practice real hard to piss me off. You did not write to me about the book. Remember I was talking about the mentally challeged kids.Bache tujhe dua denge gandu.Hey thats a better name than Gandalf. See you later Gandalf the Gandu. Star Wars next movie is looking for a title.How about,Gandu strikes back. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 174 of 377 ) gandalf, matherchot, stop commenting on kashmir and any thing to do with north india. you said it was none of your concern as you are a southern ugly sister fucking moron. ok buddy. you said you wanted to secede from india with your southern monkeys. fuck off you imbecile benchot. comment only on what goes on in that fucked up dravidian land of yours. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 175 of 377 ) jbindra, could not disagree with you more about how to handle the problem in kashmir and with pakistan. politics is not a wish list as to what you ideally want. politics is what you make of it. first off what you say is factually incorrect. there are not twice as many troops as people in kashmir. that is bullshit. there are half a million security personnel of all hues in all of J & K. the population is in tens of millions. where did you get this foolish dream. as for pakistan we have talked to them over and over again. there is no reason to talk to the jehadi bastards any more. only a full scale war will solve the problem with pakistan. peace comes out of war and strength, not by wishing for it. after that, a weak pakistan will have to be controlled. the kashmir problem will be automatically solved after that. indian troops will be withdrawn by default. as for terrorism your bullshit surprises me. terrorism is being indulged in by the muslim jehadis. the security forces are countering this menace. sometimes there are excesses, omissions, and commissions. that is not terrorism. the army is also doing many fine things in kashmir. why don't you mention that. your attitude smacks of a anti-hindu bias. if you think you can reason with the pakistanis i have got news for you. you just cannot buddy. you don't hold conversation with mad dogs. you kill them. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 176 of 377 ) gandalf: "extremely coherent and valid suggestions." That says a lot about your knowledge of this issue. you are a bleeding imbecile who seems to think that historical prejudice is a good substitute for actual real facts collected on the ground and available from multiple independent sources. Worse still, turds like you cannot defend your idiocy without getting personal. I am yet to see you make a coherent argument that stands on its own merits, and I am certainly not holding my breath. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 177 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Luvvmann : Lets get this straight. We cannot afford to go to war with Pakistan. The consequences are immense and noted as below : Nuclear Threat Pakistan hasnt signed a no first use agreement, which means it will definitely use nuclear weapons to target Indian facilities and people. Are you willing to accept the killing of innocent civilians to the tune of millions, to realise your foolish dream of world domination ? World Scenario No country will come to aid India in its effort to seek supremacy. The US and its allies are concentraing on stampin out Osama and Saddam to get back in control of world oil. They care not for the Indian or Pakistani people. Russia wont interfere as it depends on the US for massive amounts of aid. Post 1971 the reality is much different. Economic Factors War costs money and each time we fight one we kick ourselves in the stomach. It is more important to feed and educate and win a war with words and ink than with bullets and tridents. The former beings long last peaceful solutions while the latter brings nothing more but more hatred. Give us valid answers and perhaps I will agree that we need not mediate but go and "kill the jehadi bastards". Lets see what you have to say ! |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 178 of 377 ) jbindra, every time you try to make yourself look civilized, the more of a "gadha" you come out as. nuclear threat: my foot. the motherfuckers will not have the guts to use nuclear weapons. if they do, the motherfuckers don't know how to aim them. half of them are bloody fucking duds. yes, a few will get thru if they use them. yes, we have to be prepared for anything as far as pakistan is concerned. pakistan will use nukes only as a last resort. our aim should be to engage pakistan in a long and costly war that they can never win. they do not have the depth to win a war. the faster we do that the better it would be. a long war is in india's favor. it will create internal tensions and a possible break up of pakistan into pakistan punjab, pakhtoonistan, and baluchistan. even sindh can create problems. so, our strategy should be to bleed pakistan until it breaks. i do not believe this will take very long. world scenario: why are you fucking concerned about world scenario. it is the pakistani bastards who should be concerned about that. we have resources that they don't have. the hijda rashid qureshi (musharrafs side kick) was terrified when he saw the indian army on the move. then when he knew that vajpayee was bluffing he started to relax and get back to his old foolish self. russia will always support india, no matter what. they don't have a choice. india is stronger than russia in resources. an attack on tarbela and mangla power stations will cripple pakistan. don't be a fucking sissy. war means losses on both sides. our losses are bearable and the consequences are of great benefit to india. economic consequences: are you a complete hijda. who should be worrying about the economic consequesnces. india or pakistan. are you communist jokers complete fucking morons. pakistan is on the brink of bankruptcy. indian resources are immense when compared to pakistan. what is wrong with your jokers. a small percent of gold held by the indian population is enough to finance a war with pakistan. i think you fuckers need to get your heads examined. isn't the massive indian deployement in kashmir for 20 years costing money. that is much more expensive than a direct war. in all the wars india has fought in the last 50 years 15,000 soldiers have died. in kashmir alone 60,000 have died including civilians. war is much more economical. pakistan cannot take kashmir. if it could it would have by now. as for punjab, no matter what the sikhs think of india, they hate pakistan more. no sikh fucker is going to let the pakistani army into indian punjab. india should make a decision to take all sikh shrines in pakistan for good. that is enough to motivate the sikhs and hindus too. what can pakistan do in rajasthan and gujarat. not much. so please grow up and do not behave like a fucking sissy. if anyone should be afraid of war it should be pakistan. are you a punjabi or a fucking bengali communist from calcutta. i can understand those fuckers making stupid statements, but not a punjabi sikh. you fucking surprise me. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 179 of 377 ) jbindra: "Nuclear Threat Pakistan hasnt signed a no first use agreement, which means it will definitely use nuclear weapons to target Indian facilities and people" So are you trying to tell us that if they sign a no-first use treaty, then we can rest assured that they will never violate it?? War with pakistan is not an option because of China, not pakistan. A war with pakistan will completely widen the economic gap between India and China, and that is not acceptable. Of course, the grand Indian strategy of doing nothing seems to be always appropriate as far as the Indian govt. is concerned. "No country will come to aid India in its effort to seek supremacy." Ha ha ha, this is the most hilarious statement jbindra has made yet. Jbindra, are you trying to tell me that today's world powers became powers with external assistance, or do you think that the govts. of these states exploiting of the, pride, strength, and will of their own citizens has comething to do with it?? If you want power, you take it. Why would anyone else let you have power, when they could have it themselves. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 180 of 377 ) The only way India will earn the respect of world powers and become a power in its own right, is for India to ACT like a power and SOLVE its own problems. As long as India is filled with whining, bleeding-heart imbeciles like jbindra and the rest of the socialist/communist leftovers in the older generations(who would not recognize their own self-interest if it stripped naked in front of them), India will not demonstrate the ability to take care of its own. Look how imbeciles like jbindra cower when the pakistani assholes blatantly piss on Indian interests. sheesh. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 181 of 377 ) jbindra: "Are you willing to accept the killing of innocent civilians to the tune of millions, to realise your foolish dream of world domination ? " Sorry for butting in between you and luwmann, but how will destroying pakistan help in world domination, please do explain. You clearly have a point of view that most people dont (except for those who have been straightjackets for a good part of their lives). |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 182 of 377 ) karapall, i agree with your rebuttal to jbindra, but, i do not agree with the china factor as put by you. i don't understand it. i don't think that is the issue at all. while india is definitely behind china economically, a total war with pakistan and it's defeat will bring a peace dividend. yes, if it turns nuclear we will pay dearly. but then pakistan will not exist at all. either way a war costs money and a war is waged when benefits accrue. i think india would do well to finish the pakistani threat. i think it is well worth the result for both countries. china will not intervene under the present circumstance. it did not in 1971 or 1965. sorry, i do not understand your reasoning. maybe you can explain. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 183 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Hear Ye, Hear All According to our friends Luvvman and Karapall what India needs to do is as under : Nuke Pakistan and in return be willing to let them destroy the India that we have so painfully built despite corrupt politicians and fundamentalists like themselves. Establish a power structure like the Taliban in India the only difference being religion, where you can do any thing and get away with it. Which would include descerating every mosque, church and non hindu religious structure in sight. Those who would not conform only deserve to be raped and molested and finally be burnt to end their pityful existence. You can imagine the outcome of such measures. Where did you guys come from I wonder ? I could never believe that Indians could indeed be so mentally incapacitated until I read your posts. For God's sake have some shame and restrain yourselves from re-affirming our faith in your ignorance. Attending primary school would be a good option for young kids make more sense than yourself. |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 184 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron jbindra, Read today's newspaper and tell me whether we should still talk to Pakistan? If yes,then I make sure that you dont see me face to face because what you will get a swift kick between your legs.If you still feel that we should talk then here is my opinion. You are a certified chut who wants to put up a show that you are the most cultured human in the world.I am falling short of words to write a condolence message to all those who died today.Please express your visesh tippani and a small condolence message. You know what,its good that people like you are not in India.You are better in US licking the third grade american foreign policy and talking the Gandhian bullshit. PS: Dont forget to write a condolence message.My english is very very poor and my vocabulary is frantically searching for words to express my grief.You sound more educated and more CULTURED compared to me.Oh,Yeh who can doubt that. Da umr shukraguzar rahoonga. Yours UNCULTURED,IGNORANT, INSULAR,FUNDAMENTALIST HINDU |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 185 of 377 ) We shall overcome. anand_n : I join you in your sorrow and condolence for the Indians who were matyred today. Their lives have indeed been taken for a cause that lacks justification. However, if we did talk and did so with reason and a firm tenor, it would illustrate to them that our resolve and intent is unquestionable to have an amicable solution to this problem and stop the killing once and for all. I know it isnt easy to see your fellow citizens being slaughtered but the trade-off which you suggest - War - will kill many millions. We came close to a nuclear confrontation in Kargil and perhaps it was God's mercy that we escaped that without sustaining massive civilian loss of life. Your anger is justified, but will you be any happier to see Bombay or Delhi decimated if we managed to conquer Pakistan ? What is unpardonable will always be so, but we must not become violent because our adversary is decides to be such. They only need realise that violence doesnt work with us and that we want them to get to the real issues than religious fundamentalism and Kashmiri "Azaadi". That being that human life needs to be respected and the people of India, Kashmir and Pakistan need to learn to live in harmony and stop hating one another. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 186 of 377 ) jbindra, i would call you a fucking matherchot for your reply, but i am beginning to pity you. the pakistani bastards murder our children and you want to talk to the bastards. the reason for all this trouble is pakistan and it's existance. unles and until we go to war and conquer pakistan and decimate it's military this problem will never end. we have talked enough, shown enough restraint, shown more than enough patience. a dialogue can be held with decent people not with pathological criminals. pakistani mentality is a criminal mentality, it is religion gone astray, it is hatred without basis, it is crooked islam that sustains this mentality. throw your cada away and wear some chudiyan. you are not a sikh, it is not possible. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 187 of 377 ) jbindra, pakistan will not have the guts to nuke india. if they do they will cease to exist. we have to take the chance and finish them off now. the more bombs they get the more ruthless they will become. this blackmail has to be ended once and for all. please do not mislead the indian public. you are a disgrace to your country and community. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 188 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Luvvman : First and foremost I do not need my religious beliefs to be certified on the bedrock of your corrupt and fundamentalist immoral ideals. What you say and write, only goes on to prove that you are a mentally incapacitated individual who lives on the nourishment of hatred and conjured stories which you probably dream when youre asleep. Why do you think they will not Nuke India ? They have always done wierd things in desperation and further if you do indeed "decimate" them do you think they wouldnt offer their bombs to terrorists to do what they couldnt ? Youre fighting an organized military and government not some rag tag army like the Taliban. Youre an insult to Indians and to Hindus. I have met so many wonderful and intelligent Hindus, but you must indeed be one mistake. Any ideas why you are so ? Perhaps your parents adopted you from your uncle who married against your families wishes. That explains your fanatic beliefs. |
|
jaypee 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 189 of 377 ) Pakistan will not nuke india only until it is pushed to wall say the Indian Army reaches Islamabad and is about to put the indian flag over there. Pakistan has always worked on the theory that India shall be subjected to enough international pressure so that it does not retaliate (because both countries possess nuclear weapons and these people self proclaim a high moral position) and therefore, Pakistan can perpetrate the act of terrorism inside the Indian territory with diffidence. Kargil was probably much more bold move by Pakistani army but was again based on the above premise. Jbindra, do not get emotional when you are talking of war and matters of national security. Tough times require tough measures and if indians decimate Pakistanis then probably for a very long time the terrorism shall be wiped out. Pakistan is the terrorism and they are not willing to relinquish when it comes to India as their real intentions showed their face in the attacks on Indian Parliament and J&K assembly and just yesterday in the killings of woman and children in Jammu. Jbindra, overcome we must in this situation but we must overcome that we owe the future generations of India a life free of terrorism and any other issue of significance that afflicts India today. State sponsored terrorism exported from Pakistan is the biggest afflcition and is tailor made for bleeding India. There is no doubt that India will survive but the generations shall go wasted. And dear Jbindra, let us not talk about what is the insult to India and Hinduism. None of us have credentials to come to a judgement on the vast subject as India is or a divine subject like Hinduism. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 190 of 377 ) jbinra: "I know it isnt easy to see your fellow citizens being slaughtered but the trade-off which you suggest - War - will kill many millions. We came close to a nuclear confrontation in Kargil and perhaps it was God's mercy that we escaped that without sustaining massive civilian loss of life." It was not god's "mercy", you brainless motherfucker, it was the jawans who died while throwing the pakis out of the territory. At the very least, try to credit the brave jawans where it is due, asshole. Now, even is you want to apologize for the pakis, you should remember to be on the side of the Indian army. OTherwise, your rants on how nuking pakistan is wrong sounds completely traitorous (as it probably is). Words dont suffice to describe the lowly depths in which traitorous paki apologists like you crawl in. All I can say is, jbindra, you are a Fucking lowlife who needs to have his testicles ripped out and fed to monitor lizards. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 191 of 377 ) jbindra: "Why do you think they will not Nuke India ?" If they do, they will face the consequences, or is it your arguments that we should all collectively pull down our pants as Indians and offer ourselves to the pakis in return for not getting nuked. I guess the Wahe Guru's lessons on bravery and duty went over your head unfortunately. Go read up on your own religion and you might see the right path. " They have always done wierd things in desperation and further if you do indeed "decimate" them do you think they wouldnt offer their bombs to terrorists to do what they couldnt " What makes you so sure they would not offer the bombs to the terrorists anyway?? You seem to be so cocksure of that...so please do share any inside info. you have. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 192 of 377 ) jbindra: "Youre an insult to Indians and to Hindus. I have met so many wonderful and intelligent Hindus, but you must indeed be one mistake" Heh heh, the irony of a traitorous dipshit like you commenting on the lack of Indianness in others is quote amusing. Make up your mind. Are you saying that pakistan is not India's enemy?? Or are you saying that it is India's mortal enemy, but "taling to pakistan" is the only way out?? If it is the latter, morons like you should pay attention to all the "talking" that has been going on for the past decade with the paki vermin. As they say, if you dont know history, you are doomed to repeat it (even if this history is restricted to the past few decades). |
|
nishi 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 193 of 377 ) Mera Bharat Mahan ! Really ? Simple question for all the hardline fundamentalists here. Why is that when someone does not conform to your views he becomes a traitor or Pakistani if he's not Hindu or a Kafir if he's not muslim ? You people have the same flesh and blood except for the fact that one wears a green cloak and the other a saffron one and has a little bit more foreskin. You people are pathetic. Call yourselves protectors of religion but when it comes to doing a good deed, you simply go killing and molesting children. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 194 of 377 ) Lowman.. your are a disgrace to the cockroach I squashed yesterday. A person is concerned about deaths of millions in cities and you as 'keeper of country honor" based in Nagpur I am sure, pass judgement?. I hope nuclear war happens .. I would be the best way to clean the northern puss we have accumulated. (Apologies to others). I am sure lowman is not sitting in Idia at this point of time else he or it would have sang a different tune |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 195 of 377 ) Well said nishi.. I think the problem with the hardliners is the problem with foreskins ..unfortunately.. does not arise. (pun not intended!) |
|
jnan 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 196 of 377 ) muslim kill hindu kill muslim kill cristians kill muslim kill who else all religion. Great happening around. I m happy about this. Friends, Great saint once said "End of Religion is Begining of Spirutuality, End of Spirutuality is begining of Reality, End of Reality is the real bliss". now i see all religion getting washed away and then there will be peace. ha ha ha cool guys. my intensions are clear lets end religion itself. |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 197 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron jbindra and company, Yo,gandalf,good that you are back.We were missing a moron in the discussion.I wonder why there is so much of money being spent on discovering how we transformed into humans.You are a standing example of an ape.Asshole,atleast for once stop aping someone and post your own opnions. jbindra, I am tired of your BS.Let me make this clear.No one,Okey,correction,atleast I dont want a war with Pakistan.I am not a warmonger and I am sure there are millions of peace loving Indians like me BUT when someone does not allow you to enjoy your life the only solution is,you screw what remains of him. Dont turn your back on the fact that Pakis are bent upon having a war with us.Consider this scenario,what do we do of they declare a war or what do we do if they decide to nuke us or lets say that what do we do AFTER they nuke us? Still talk? Man,why dont you get it into your brain that they DONT WANT TO TALK.Agra and Lahore proves it. You are talking about dousing a forest fire with a full bladder.Who the fuck cares about the discomfort you carry.In the interest of the nation we need to be ready for a war.Yes we always hold the olive branch out but we dont take shit for long. So my dear friend,stop talking emotions and let some sense prevail.No one wants to see Delhi or Mumbai in a nuclear heap but if that has to happen it will.Its immaterial what BS talk or emotions moderates like you hold. Nishi stop being sentimental.Go write a script for Manoj Kumar's next movie. Idiot,we dont have humans as our neighbours.They are animals and need to be treated like one. |
|
fayaz 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 198 of 377 ) anand_n "No one wants to see Delhi or Mumbai in a nuclear heap but if that has to happen it will.Its immaterial what BS talk or emotions moderates like you hold" Naturally youre well ensconced in some posh neighbourhood of London or New York to let Delhi and Mumbai become a nuclear heap. Are people just numbers to you or does their life mean anything. Please dont take this as an attack, just a simple question to the more learned on this BBS. |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 199 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron Fayaz, You are right.Yup,Im in US. Just read The Times of India today.Its screaming a section that clearly voices the opinions of our partioned brothers. For your kind information,people are not numbers to be,if they would then I will not be posting my opnions here. Please read my previous postings and get back to me.Coming to Pakistan.As the article rightly says its a nation that is destined to doom.50 years of see-saw with democracy and dictatorship has made it a rouge state.Its been a breeding ground for fundamentalist and the shishya wants to overtake the Guru's. They (read:Pakistani Leardership)are nothing but a bunch of disgruntled morons who screwed their country with literally 0 development and now cannot take the fact that India is in a better position,economically and finacially. By the way,I retaliate only when provoked.So dont worry dude,there will be no profanity from my side till you use it. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 200 of 377 ) Anand_n (sauve Sniper) hahaha, why dont you go and play a video game. I really wish there was an Indian MB, where Indians who have to face issues here discuss. These NRI types get buggered by some black in the subway and they channel their frustration though Web sites. Anand , take a nice crap.. go to the nearest Indian store or Indian association meeting and leave the board alone |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 201 of 377 ) For the average Indian, it will do him good if Pakistan, Bangladesh etc were prosperous.. as prosperity is interlinked. So I wish Islamic fundementalism in Pakistan is squashed, but I wish Pakistan as a country becomes a stable prosperous nation just the same as I wish for India |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 202 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron Gandalf, The return of the moron.Need I say anything more. Eww,Why dont you volunteer.I will sponser your ONE WAY ticket to Pakistan.I am sure you can teach those Jehadi's some JAVA.Dont worry,I will order copies of Java for Dummies for your Jehadi brothers. So all the best "SENSE KNOCKER". Anand |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 203 of 377 ) Anand. "The return of the moron.Need I say anything more" No you dont, your stupid nick name is enough to tell us your moronic antecedents. So whats your point.. You did not beat the top score on your video game?.. Pls get lost and shoots somemore aliens or whatever you are playing and stay out of serious discussions |
|
anand_n 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 204 of 377 ) Ask me about Gandalf,the Moron Gandalf, This nickname is perfect,right? Your ticket is ready.Its open,ONE WAY ofcourse. Send me your address. Lots of love Anand |
|
cooldude 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 205 of 377 ) Wow, third countries are doing great. Waiting for the great nuclear show. Good luck India, All the best Pakistan :) |
|
rohini 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 206 of 377 ) Funny, you guys talking about war when you can't keep it out of a simple discussion. Move over, guys! Came looking for some good discussion, found only personal diaries. Hope next visit is more worth it. |
|
rav666 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 207 of 377 ) rohini, yes - hopefully next time around you will have something to contribute..... |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 208 of 377 ) dick sucking bastards fayaz and gandalf, take a break from getting buggered by stinking mullahs. bastards do not bathe. ok. they have gonnorhea and puss in their heads. fuckers, what pakistan deserves is a one way ticket to hell. musharraf should be buggered in public at canuaght place and then chopped into pieces to be eaten by vultures and pigs. let me tell you two matherchots, war with pakistan is not only inevitable but necessary. the country is illegal and a threat to india. it should be eliminated from the map. no ifs and buts about it. stop sucking musharrafs dick and take a break you pig shit eating imbeciles. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 209 of 377 ) Poor lowman.. just because you were abused as a child, dont hurt yourself so. It was definitely not your fault. It was that uncle in Khaki shorts you subconsiously trying so hard to please. Do you dream of seeing Musharaff getting buggered?.. You must be really troubled.. give me you address and I will come and take care of all you problems.. Keep the khaki Knickers clean though. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 210 of 377 ) Lowman, I always though you were a poor sucker abused by your Khaki clad uncle but maybe I am wrong. I know its painful to recollect but was it a large oinker that did the wild thing with you at that tender immpressionable age? Yuch.. there goes my appetite for bacon |
|
fayaz 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 211 of 377 ) I dont know why you should abuse me when I didnt use any uncouth language, but I cant answer for Luvman. Most probably you chose to say seeing a Muslim name. I am not surprized having read so many other write ups by you. However, all that is being said on the MB is that all peaceful options be exhausted before we goto war, which is definitely going to be a Nuclear war. Hope you will be more polite in your response. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 212 of 377 ) fayaz, "all that is being said on the MB is that all peaceful options be exhausted before we goto war" what do you think India has been doing for the past 10 years? Do you have the brains to recall that Mushy came to agra and shat all over Indian hospitality?? Not to mention that he got traitorous turds like vinod mehta to suck his dick and lick his boots before they had their breakfast with him. The question is: why do muslims like you seem to think that appeasing pakistan is more important than ensuring that the irrational hate pakistanis have for India and Indians is neutralized permanently?? Is it because you place pakistani interests above Indian interests, or because you believe that nuclear blackmailers must be appeased no matter what?? If it is the latter, then you clearly know little about the evils of succumbing to nuclear blackmail. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 213 of 377 ) fayaz: "I dont know why you should abuse me when I didnt use any uncouth language" Support for the pakistani position at a time of war is certainly traitorous, in addition to being uncouth. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 214 of 377 ) fayaz, the reason you don't want war has nothing to do with finding a peaceful solution. india has been trying not to retaliate for a decade. the reason muslims like you do not want a war is because you are almost certain it will be the end of pakistan. your sympathies are with pakistan and not india. your balanced view is a "cover" for your hatred for india and the not so secret desire to protect "muslim" pakistan. if pakistan were in a position to win, you would be the first to advocate war (nuclear or non-nuclear) to kill the hindus and india. also, commie matherchots like gandalf do not want india to win a war because they have this obsession with hindutva. this smelling "dravidian" matherchot hates hindus, india, hindi etc. and couches his prejudices by being anti-indian. little does this bastard know that hindus are mostly dravidian. it would be instructive to note that this asshole gandalf has criticized india a million times, but not one bad word for pakistan. he wants pakistan to prosper so that they can create more problems for india. it would suit this sister fucker gandalf well. it sums up the true intentions of people like gandalf, tathaghat, vohsendhan etc. stupid self hating stinking puss filled ugly looking empty brained apes (sorry to insult apes). ok fayaz, i spared you my bad words. if you are a gentleman excuse me. we can talk without bad words. i know what adab and rivaz are. assholes like gandalf emanating from the forests of kerala do not understand the concept of adab and dostanna. if you understand it, i surely do. |
|
fayaz 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 215 of 377 ) Karapall - The balanced view doesnt have anything to do with me being a Muslim and having a soft corner for "Muslim Pakistan" or their interests. Frankly speaking, that nation is a mockery, be it of Islam or that of a democracy. My only concern is that we -- Indians, will loose a lot more in a war. An enemy who knows that it will be decimated and which has nuclear arms is sure to act in desperation. And I do not want my fellow Indians to die for nothing. What happens if we win the war ? (Which we will) We will be made to retreat and then Pakistan will be another Afghanistan where the fundamentalists will hold power and create even more trouble for India. If destroying Pakistan and crippling the saner elements in that nation is to our interest, please explain how. Before we go to war, we must analyse what we will do once it's over so that the very evil that we are fighting does not emerge even more emboldened again. Our sacrifice (economic, human etc.) must not go awaste. Your comments are requested and hopefully in language that is free from obscenity. |
|
fayaz 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 216 of 377 ) Luwman - the reason muslims like you do not want a war is because you are almost certain it will be the end of pakistan. your sympathies are with pakistan and not india. your balanced view is a "cover" for your hatred for india and the not so secret desire to protect "muslim" pakistan. if pakistan were in a position to win, you would be the first to advocate war (nuclear or non-nuclear) to kill the hindus and india This is absolutely unacceptable. You have eloquently said that I am a traitor before even providing any reasons for your motivation to go to a war, where we stand to loose much more than an already destroyed and usless nation. I dont think that when you think in such a way and allude all Muslims to be traitors and accessories of Pakistan that there is any scope for discussion and I am sure you understand what I mean. Finally, When you say that Indian Muslims want to see the end of Hindus -- I am simply aghast at your conclusion. Luwman at 15% of 1 billion, that is the second largest Muslim population in the world after Indonesia. If all of them were indeed like you make them out to be, (Hindu haters and recepients of Pakistani sympathy) India would be a far less peaceful place than it is. And if indeed what you say is true then we shall soon realise that our missiles which were the result of a Muslim's tireless efforts with his fellow Indians, wont simply work. Because he is a traitor isnt he and he wouldnt want to let his inventions be used against Pakistan which he may "secretly desire" to protect. We are all Indians and no matter what religion we follow, the simple idea is the same - Live and let others live. Naturally there are fanatical elements everywhere but it doesnt mean that we make them the characterisation of a religion. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 217 of 377 ) fayaz, great. if you are with india i salute you. i don't blame all muslims. you have not been reading my postings. i blame hindus first for being cowards and liars. but muslims are fanatics, no matter which way you look at it. muslims as a group in india have pakistan sympathies. that cannot be denied. that does not mean they are monolithic. pakistani muslims slaughtered bengali muslims. but, do bangla muslims behave any different than pakistani muslims when it comes to india and hindus. absolutely not. yes, abdul kalam is from kerala. but do muslims in kerala profess secularism. absolutely not. it is a hotbed of muslim communalism and they vote only for the muslim league. this same league wanted pakistan and got it by spilling blood. the 15% muslim population is all india can take to survive. any increase will plunge the country into chaos and bloodshed. muslims as a group do not believe in live and let live. islam does not permit that especially with kafirs. no amount of obfuscation will alter that fact. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 218 of 377 ) fayaz, if vajpayee does not wage war and crush pakistan, india will face disaster. up until now vajpayee has proved conclusively that he is a fool. he has lost his mental balance trying to make peace with pakistan. this peace is not possible. pakistan is not a failed state. it is a fanatic muslim state. it has the support of china, england, and america. all these countries have their own reason to hurt india. china has supplied atom bombs to pakistan and pakistan is only too happy to use them. america and england do not want a strong india. they want a pakistan they can control. they want an independent kashmir they can control. indians have to fight their own wars. they have to break pakistan into pieces. small countries that cannot harm india. after all pakistan is a part of india and so is bangla. only muslim fanaticism is keeping them as separate countries. it is better to control 3 or 4 smaller countries than a big one that has vowed it's enemity for india. i totally disagree with you. if india fails to destroy the pakistani military machine, disaster will follow. vajpayee is the biggest fool around. he is still holding back and not attacking pakistan, thinking america will come to help india. either he is going senile or he is an idiot. either way india is in trouble. today the whole country wants war (except the matherchot anti-national communists like gandalf and tathaghat). the army is rearing to go. even the poorest of the poorest man on the street is fed up. by the way these villagers and uneducated people have more sense than sister fuckers like gandalf and tathagat. these simple people on the street have common sense that these communist cocksuckers lack. WAR is the only way to peace. there is no other way. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 219 of 377 ) fayaz: "Before we go to war, we must analyse what we will do once it's over so that the very evil that we are fighting does not emerge even more emboldened again. Our sacrifice (economic, human etc.) must not go awaste." I see, so unless we can predict the future with great certainty, we must not go to war?? Mind explaining why?? Wars are based on defending national interests and our govt. has spent the past four decades sitting on its hands. The pakistan problem is now upon us; their nuclear capability will only increase over time, thanks to our "friends" in China. So the question you need to ask yourself is: if war is inevitable between India and Pakistan, would you rather have it now when pakistan is weak, or would you rather pakistan grow fat from all the bakshish it receives from the west on a regular basis AND THEN go to war with Pakistan causing more deaths than it will now. In the end, peaceniks need to pull their heads out of their anus and read and analyze the path of extreme confrontation taken by pakistan with material support from China and the US. |
|
fayaz 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 220 of 377 ) Karapall -- Let me answer your question. If you do not know what you are going to achieve by going to war and visualise the long term benefits that you will gain from it, the investment in lives and lucre is not worth it. What we want is to destroy the elements that excerbate terrorism in India, so that we can live in peace. We also want Kashmir back. Surely there are smarter ways to do this than have them turn India into a test site for their missiles and Nuclear bombs. You say it is better to attack them when they have 25 bombs instead of 250. But just look what they can destroy -- an advancing world power like India and what we can destroy -- a failed nation. Covert tactics and fomenting internal resistance will be sufficient to ruin the people who thrive by professing hatred for India. We have many cards to play -- Mohajir Vs. Punjabis, Shites Vs. Sunni. Lets give them a taste of their own medicine and not squabble amongst ourselves. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 221 of 377 ) fayaz, a very good try. pakistan is not a threat to india only in kashmir. it is a threat per se for ever, if allowed to contnue on it's merry journey. pakistan has only one international goal - fuck india. well we need to have one goal -fuck pakistan and destroy it. we can do it now and we should - even nuclear war. pakistani bad behavior is directly proportonal to the number of bombs and missiles they have. pakistan can never be india's friend. it's mission is to fuck india and really the hindus. break the god forsaken country into pieces - fucking muslim punjab, sindh, baluchistan. cede NW fontier province to afghanistan. control these fucking animals and never let them get nuclear or other weapons again. if vajpayee has any brains left(he lost them at lahore and agra)he will go all the way. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 222 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Fayaz : Why are you trying to reason with these blood thirsty rabid creatures who would even make wolves and hyenas proud of themselves. I am sure you do notice that though you use civil language, Mr. Luvvman doesnt seem to mind calling you a fucking muslim . Luvvman : You barbarian. Who in the world would believe all your gibberish. Not a iota of knowledge or common sense, just brainwashed to repeat who was stuffed up your behind until it reached your head and stuck there. I am sure the sanghis did a pretty good job of brainwashing you with their excremental fluids. Not your fault poor boy. Talks of war Goddamn it. You'll be the first to cry fowl when the time comes for you to make a sacrifice. How about joining the armed forces and putting some action into your speeches. Oh !! I forgot the armed forces didnt allow pariahs did they. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 223 of 377 ) fayaz: "If you do not know what you are going to achieve by going to war and visualise the long term benefits that you will gain from it, the investment in lives and lucre is not worth it." I see, so setting a precedent by releasing kashmir to pakistan (which is, by the way, the ONLY option pakistan is willing to accept), is in India's interests?? Do you think the people who manage affairs in India are too stupid to weigh the pros and cons, unlike you?? Do you really believe that the Indian govt. will go to war without performs tradeoff analyses and cost/benefit analysis?? Do you know the process by which the Indian govt. comes to this decision?? Here is a hint: it is not done over a cup of chai between Advani and Vajpayee, as you seem to believe. In the end, the leaders need to be trusted by the citizens, failing which India does not deserve to exist as a country. Just break it up and allow the turds in north India to fend for itself and the south Indians states to become roaring successes without the worthless north Indian states as deadweights. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 224 of 377 ) jbindra, for all your cries of "no war", do you even understand the dangers of paki terrorists within the paki army getting their hands on nukes?? Do you have the brains to understand the end game if we delay war and allow the chinese to give more dangerous weapons to the pakis?? Of all the cretins on this board, you are probably the stupidest motherfucker of the lot. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 225 of 377 ) jbindra, Just because you are under some illusion that you are not a "barbarian" because you have been house-trained by white people, it does not mean that Indians who live in India are clueless as to the exact nature of the pakistani problem. Go educate yourself before harboring illusions that you fully understand the pakistani problem. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 226 of 377 ) fayaz: "Surely there are smarter ways to do this than have them turn India into a test site for their missiles and Nuclear bombs." Mind elaborating?? Please do tell me your prescription, and maybe we can solve the current problem thanks to your unbridled genius. By the way, I hope you have been following India's interactions with pakistan in the last 20 years closely and understand the strategies that have been tried before by the Indians. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 227 of 377 ) fayaz: "You say it is better to attack them when they have 25 bombs instead of 250. But just look what they can destroy -- an advancing world power like India and what we can destroy -- a failed nation." Firstly, India is a third-rate power with potential, but going by the way Indians undercut their own interests in order to get a pat on the back from white people, I dont see India achieving any power status for a LONG time from now. Secondly, even if India became a world power and pakistan remained a basket case, would you rather have pakistan destroy what we build today?? Isn't it smarter to solve the paki problem once and for all AND THEN start builing India?? Thirdly, world powers take care of their own interests. If Indians cannot take care of a failed state like pakistan, then they are a third-rate power by definition. So you should probably quit swallowing all the crap written by white people about India being a world power, and understand that these countries talk about India being a world power precisely to undercut any initiative on our part to defend ourselves, and if we go by your response, they have read the Indian mentality VERY WELL indeed. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 228 of 377 ) jbindra, you are already crying foul BEFORE a war erupts, so you are hardly the only to point fingers at other Indians who at least have the courage to STAY IN INDIA when they make such sanctimonious pronouncements. You sit on you fat punjabi ass in some western country and travel on the net everyday to remind the lowly, barbaric indians that they are not civilized unlike you!! You are a pathetic, cowardly asshole, and a fool to boot. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 229 of 377 ) fayaz, My apologies for yelling at you previously. You seem to be rational enough to hold your own, and I apologize for various taunts/insults. Now, the problem with your line of "but we might lose what we have" is a legitimate one, and one that I have supported until now. India's enemy is china, not pakistan. However, pakistan's nukes must be eliminated (preferably by someone else) and the pakistani leadership MUST BE DESTROYED. The pakistani people will probably be a lot more sensible than the pakistani elite which controls ALL THE POWER CENTRES in pakistan AND ALL THE ENGLISH MEDIA in pakistan. Now, I believe that the current Indian strategy of slow escalation will bring us dividends, as it has already made Musharraf make SEVERAL crucial strategic errors. However, we need to understand that there are ONLY TWO AVAILABLE OPTIONS FOR INDIA: (1) Pakistan ceases aiding terrorists in the IMMEDIATE future (2) India destroys pakistan's ability to hurt us for the forseeable future via military action. If (1) does not happen, India has no course other than pursuing (2), not least because all other options have been exhausted by the GoI. We have tried to be rational with the paki elite, but being rational to inherently irrational paki jihadis like Musharraf and all the other terrorists in the paki army/terror groups is an exercise in monumental stupidity. For example, suppose that a mad man is really stressing you out with his antics, and I always advise you to be nice and reason it out with him, whose fault is it if you take my advise and get increasingly stressed out in the process?? Maybe the first few times before you understand the level of madness, you can be excused for taking my advise. But if you insist on "reasoning" with the madman knowing fully well that it is a futile exercise, then you have no one else to blame but yourself. This analogy fits the current India-pakistan situation to a tee. Pakistan wants to destroy India from the inside-out just to prove jinnah's two-nation theory correct. (why else would pakistan create terror ALL OVER INDIA, and not restrict itself to kashmir??) The indian public, on the other hand, seem to be too naive and trusting to understand that there are certain things in the world that are absolutely evil, such as the paki elite, who have not only screwed ordinary pakistanis while keeping their hold on the country, they have also made up their mind to destroy their own country (by nuking India) rather than loosen their grip on power. This is just plain dangerous and evil, and for Indians like you to downplay this is an enormous insult to the memory of all the Indians who have died in the past few decades due to paki perfidy. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 230 of 377 ) jbindra, the fact that you are a sister fucking hindu hating fool is obvious. but, let us cut the bullshit. if not war what is the option with pakistan. if war is never the option, then will pakistan stop it's terrorist activities. not just in kashmir. in all of india. it is fomenting trouble everywhere. so, we need to put up with it all the time. is that your intention and solution. i think the other option is much better. destroy the pakistani state and make smaller fucking countries where muslim animals and jehadis can live (you can go and suck their stinking dicks if you wish kuthe). i stand by my solution and i predict that pakistan will nuke india, war or no war. it will use terrorists to do it because pakistan is a terrorist country. pakistani people are hindu hating matherchots, suwar ke aulads. it is not just musharraf or the army that is the problem. it is the muslim mind and islam that are the problem. islam has to be suppressed because islam believes in suppressing others. the stronger person wins. so, if we pussy foot around then the islamic animals will win. sorry, i do not agree with you. the fact is you are a khalistani supporter hell bent on keeping india weak. hoping one day pakistan will help you with your foolish dream. let me tell you matherchot, that day will never come. if vajpayee and advani do not continue to act like buffoons, we can yet solve this problem. they are still hung over with their lahore and agra fiascos. they still are unable to admit to their terrible mistakes (gandhi syndrome). we have to fuck pakistan out of the map now. tomorrow will be too late. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 231 of 377 ) just to add, china is also india's enemy. but, pakistan has to be fucked, before we can call china's bullshit. china is a formidable enemy and has to be matched in every way (military and economic). india's long term goal should be to foment trouble in tibet for china. that is the only way to keep china off balance. |
|
rt 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 232 of 377 ) luvvmann seems to have cracked the code of life. "Might is right". Had that not been the principle that humanity had lived by, we would have probably had the population of about 5.99 billion instead of 6 billion of human beings that abound in the world. Bravo; you seem to have the secret of logivity and prosperity. Ofcourse; what else. You think it is the message of love by Buddha, Jesus and Mohommed that would have had anything to do with it? NO way. Or is it the hundreds of thousands of scientists who have been working very hard from the begining of time to improve our health and comforts; to increase the yield of the crops so morrons like me and other 6billion people can feed themselves; canot be.(ofcourse not Mr. luvvmann; he lives by his principles he does not need anybody but his "Indian" and "Hindu" greatness). |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 233 of 377 ) rt, actually i am not sure what your miniscule mind is trying to conjure up. the fact is might is right. othr things also matter. when was might not right. please explain. |
|
Tathagat 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 234 of 377 ) appa DeepO bhava In future... Buddhadesh agreeing 4 a thoord party mediation after much isolation... and PaaKiss reluctant in accepting long time india ally Russia... Mullah Nasruddin was dreaming that someone had counted nine gold pieces into his hand, but Mullah Nasruddin insisted that he would not accept less than ten pieces. While he was arguing with the man over one gold piece, he was awakened by a sudden noise in the street. Seeing that his hand was empty, Mullah Nasruddin quickly closed his eyes, extended his hand as if he was ready to receive, and said, "Very well, my friend, have it your way. Give me nine." On why there is so much hulla-gulla panic on 'Our' just nu_clear war... ABV wud say... Once Mulla Nasruddin was asked about the end of the universe. He, instead of answering, put a question "Which end?" The person said, "How many ends are there?" He said, "When my wife dies, it was the small end and when I die, that will be the big end." ha ha ha! As Gujarat off the media glare... after de-escalation AaDvaanii would say.... :- Mulla Nasruddin went to a garden. He saw the gardener planting trees. He asked, "What are you doing?" The gardener answered. "I am planting fruit trees to produce fruit in the future." Nasruddin said, "If you please plant me too. Let us see what type of fruit I produce." The gardener accepted his request and made him stand in a hole dug in the ground and started pouring soil in it till Mulla sunk up to the waist. After some time the chilly weather made him try to come out with a lot of difficulty and went to the gardener’s hut. The gardener asked "Why did it take so little time for you to stay there?" Mulla said, "In fact I didn’t like my position over there. In addition I thought that my fruit would also not be good enough to eat." ...If our neighbor such evil as indians made out of them... ABV wud explain EU/US/Japan/Cheen on their side:- Once Mulla Nasruddin was asked "Why in the morning some people go in one direction and other go in another direction?" Mulla said, "If they all go in one direction the equilibrium of the earth will be lost and it will not remain stable." |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 235 of 377 ) tathagat, I am sure the pakis thank you for your support in cash and kind. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 236 of 377 ) tathagat, go suck a pigs and a donkeys lund matherchot. when did they let you out of a mental asylum. bastard bengali communist shithead. |
|
bangy 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 237 of 377 ) Whether there is a need for third party mediation on kashmir or not,iam sorry i don't know.But make sure that you don't let that Paki nuke this garden city.Bangalore is more important for India than kashmir. |
|
bangy 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 238 of 377 ) What the heck if US comes to mediate on Kashmir??After all it is we who went to UN asking for a mediation..Who knows how the US role will be?..Going by the current mood of US it seems if they enter for mediation in Kashmir..there is every chance for India becoming an Israel and Pakistan becoming a Palestine.Even if it doesn't happen that way atleast we may become the Most Favoured Nation of US after we agree to hold Plebiscite in Kashmir...Either way the kashmir headache will go... |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 239 of 377 ) bangy, Third parties have no part to play in India's internal affairs, which is what the J&K problem is. No one can force India to do anything it does not want to do, even the so-called sole superpower. I wish Indians would understand this rather simple truth, but more often than not, the slavish mentality that has been rubbed into Indians for a few centuries takes over and Indians seem to think that white countries have the power to make us behave the way they want us to. Unless Indians understand this, there is little to no hope of India becoming a nation to reckon with. Indians are our own worst enemies. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 240 of 377 ) bangy, that you are living in a dreamland is quite obvious. thinking such as yours is the bane of a hindu (indian) mind. selfish matherchots who don't want to do anything but sit in a shell and hope things pass away without hurting them. kashmir is as important to india as bangalore is. when one part of the country is attacked, it means the entire country is attacked. grow up and stop behaving like a fucking retard. |
|
Tathagat 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 241 of 377 ) appa DeepO bhava Monday, June 10, 2002 9:04:11 PM ...easing O'tension… tathagat singth a song 4 yooz… aaaaN aaan…. Chham chamm baaje re payaliyaa… oh… O…O… chham baaje re payalia raah chalat lachke panihaarii x2 chhalke gagaria… aaaa chhamm chhamm baaje re payalia x2 gorre [nope, like-e-nandita daas] badan pe bheegii saaRii… ;) aur lage sundar ye naarii moti ban ban Tapke paanii bhigat jaaye dagaria chhamm chhamm baaje re payalia… chhamm chhamm baaje re payaliya chandra mukhi jab laT bhikraaye… aaaaN… aaaN… chandramukhi jab laT bhikraaye jag saara ye dhoka khaaye koii kahe lo saawan aaya aayii kaarii badaria… […no hard rain nor Nuke winter just pure life giving rain soft waali badaria…] mukhre pe aanchal mal mal ka… ya koii phool kaNwal* ka… x2 aayii na jaane kon nagar se jaaye kaun nagariya… (*AaDvaanii Lotus is done though, buried under the 2500 charred corpses and never 2 recover… they sure gonna rename as most of fascist European Parties frequently rename their fanaticism… why they need 2 do so… coz they get a bad name always with their deeds and wrong notions… ) chhamm chhamm baaje re… chhamm chhamm baaje re… chhamm chhamm baaje re payalia… jhanak tohrii baaje paayeliya… preeet ke geeet sunaaye paayeliya… noo remixes Othe rain songs... the classic... the Paakiza remix girl soo pretty... who is she?... next year good old classic rain remixes and noo ooogly Bhajpaayeez in sight [all in Jail]... than it sure will rain... satisfactorily... who raised question on Morality of de politician…? [Bharat Karnaad book release]... she [Arundhati] said it on the beeb and meant that they r jaahil… 98%-99%... including those men in power ignorant of what a nuke is… Kalaam deserve2be on the death row 4 for all the horrendous weapons he made… his crime against humanity… Naraayana gives grace 2 the throne… beside a KuNwaara Peerdhaan moontrii and a kuNwaara husband o the nasion… nooo way…. In the most populated cuntree… and yet fastest breeding… bhains da tabelaa… Mulaayam and Immortal Singh soo stupid...!!! and beside does Kalaam knows what is Indian constitution is all about?!? basics2begin with!!! such as spelling... eh!!! |
|
jogi 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 242 of 377 ) kashmir is an occupied colony,it has to be given freedom. |
|
ryounger 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 243 of 377 ) Karapall, Everything you have said is mostly correct. The problem is we in the west have not seen you solve the problem. And the problem has gone on for 50 years and 3 wars. Now we see the problem rising its ugly head again and nukes may become involved. And as far as "white countries" are concerned I could care less how you behave within your borders as long as you do solve the problems you have. If you don't, with the stakes getting ever higher, "white countries" will once again have to help your country and I would just assume not have that happen just as much as you. So, Karapall solve your problems and I can assure you at least we in the United States will cheer...we just don't expect you to solve the problem...and that is not a knock on todays India, it is just looking at the past the track record which is not good. |
|
rav666 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 244 of 377 ) ryounger, the 'white countries' might have contributed in creating the problem in the first place. 'White countries' started messing around with Middle East on one hand and Central Asia on the other, which led to the rise of the jihadi forces aided and abetted by one 'white country' to counter the influence of another 'white country'. 'White countries' have been arming the warring sides in all the conflicts that happened in these regions and have been laughing all the way to the banks. The only 'help' I can think of that the white countries can do in solving the problem is to stay away completely so that neither party is assured of the comfort of your support. With this realization, they would either talk it out or fight it out. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 245 of 377 ) ryounger: "And as far as "white countries" are concerned I could care less how you behave within your borders as long as you do solve the problems you have. If you don't, with the stakes getting ever higher, "white countries" will once again have to help your country" I suppose we are still talking about planet earth?? In that case, I would like to direct your attention to the interference of UK (primarily) and USA (during the cold war) era, where they not only handed billions of dollars but also trained the very people who later on trained all the terrorists who have hurt India (and caused 9/11). So to claim that India is incapable of solving the problem, while conveniently ignoring the rather questionable policies of the western countries in the region during the cold war, is just ridiculous. American material support and weapons is what has been propping the pakis up for the past few decades. India is fully willing to take care of pakistan on its own; guess who is stopping it from doing the needful?? So next time you visit planet earth, try to pay a little more attention, instead of making sanctimonious procalamations of how incapable these brownies are of taking care of their own affairs. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 246 of 377 ) ryounger: "So, Karapall solve your problems and I can assure you at least we in the United States will cheer.." Is that what the US is doing when it is trying to get India to submit to paki nuclear blackmail?? How interesting. Maybe you could elaborate a little bit on how you expect India should "solve" this problem?? I am sure an oracle like you has figured this one out on your own. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 247 of 377 ) The only "solution" the pakis want is for India to hand over one of its states to pakistan. If you are recommending that India follow this solution, then I suggest you go do something more useful/enjoyable to you, like flying a kite, because you are clearly a nitwit who does not have a clue about the basics. |
|
Tathagat 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 248 of 377 ) appa DeepO bhava Thursday, June 13, 2002 11:12:58 AM …ah RaajDeep from Bombay, putting other 2 chhichhora channels 2 shame… they got this kiddo reporters… btw… Manohar [me rename him Mano_haTT] Joshi is on beeb-e-Urdu [hindi] this Sunday evening… the subject is why the lower hse sound so lowest these days…?!? Ah the answer is simple… 4 the lampaTs like u hindutwa guys in there… but a lampaT party rep and rustic and lumpen u disgracing the Speakers' chair-o-chamber [why he/she is called the Speaker… he/she seldom speaks… everybody else speak 2 him/hur…]… Kalaam is no good… he couldn't be a hoosband how could he be hoosband o the nasion... lol... lacks know how… but this MJ as Speaker is a disgrace 4 sure… the record daagHdaar as a buffoon sits on it... 11:25:18 AM aah DF Govt., wins the tamaashaa… MahaGhaTyaRaashtra saved of genocidal maniacs' mis-rule… now is the time… ban all these lumpen parties… ECs u hear?!? Are u morons teethed enuff… nah u are NOT!!! Founding effin' faathers missed and messed on that… …Anita Pratap is wrong in presuming that coercive diplomacy pays… nah! Aamof[as a matter of fact] nothing 'coercive' ever pays or even could… it appears as if it is gaining but actually u loose all respect in the process… that is ur big loss… it's just that offence is the best form of defense… but than it just helps one to do time… but problem does NOT go away!!! Does it??? somebody tell keki daaruwalla[HT]… that only dogHlaaz baavaajees take govt'; word so sincerely …moolah recovery cause disillusionment in the valley… Keki Deekra if they recover controlled substances from ur premises we won't be shocked we simply won't buy it… hey press council this blackmailer Swami and lampaT sardar [tathagat would be delighted and bless Buddhadesh with a normal monsoon… if u put these and ABV and de facto, de jure u know who & lumpen company behind bars…] doin' a press con… and AajTak doin' it live was outrageous… have u got a role in there… or not… or is it just ineffective scarecrow?!? And that any tom dick and harry could do anything LIVE?!? Major setback and embarrassed … assed… lampaT badsoorat made an ass of themselves… ah Mum hooh court adjoorned the matter 4 a week... Mandella going 2 a prison 2 see ae prisoner... Lockerbie or whatever... hey Mahatma did u hear about the Gujarat [is so potent wow!!! the general answers 2 Buddha Arundhati... about that 'tike'... tiny neighbor or whatever the word she used... nah its not that... Buddhadesh, PaakissTaan and Bhaangladesh are amidst top ten most populated countries in the woorld... [ah lumpen clashes… on the rampage… another proof of them as lumpen... me off 2 the library… ] So maha aatma Mandella when do u come 2 India and visit Gujarat... the original maha aatma did sooo much 4 ur country... u owe it 2 the maha aatma... do some truth and reconciliation here too... |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 249 of 377 ) See whether you like it or not 3rd party mediation is going on. Its was in everyones interest if Ind/Pak kept on fighting but today.. face it.. some fool can start a nuclear war. That means the rest of the worl will be affected. Will you stay next to a Nuclear Power Plant? Either you will move or you will get it closed. Thats wat the world will do.. they will squeeze India/pakis balls.. Only IFS officer, bureaucrats, and kahaki shorted fools live in the dreamland of no mediation. It happend in Kargil, its happening today. Fear of mediation stems from 1. Insecurity 2. Having no clear stand on the issue other thatn no-mediation 3. having something to hide 4. Inability to solve the issue oneself cont.. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 250 of 377 ) No point ranting against western countries.. If we could produce exporable arms we would do it. Do sri lankans keep cribbing about the aid given to Prabakaran of the LTTE in the early days?.. Stultyfied kahaki brains ... please move on in life.. Why are people so scared of mediation.. might as well have it on our terms rather thatn have it thrust down our throats. And Karapall, you have a serious inferiority complex in a ddition to you low IQ as seen by your rants against "white countries" |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 251 of 377 ) gandalf: "Stultyfied kahaki brains ... please move on in life.. Why are people so scared of mediation.. might as well have it on our terms rather thatn have it thrust down our throats." Because India has tried all that before in the past 50 years, and it got screwed every time, you stupid asshole. Why dont you go read about these things before you expose yourself in public, you putrid pile of parrot puke. " And Karapall, you have a serious inferiority complex in a ddition to you low IQ as seen by your rants against "white countries" " That was a rant against the inferiority complex Indians have when it comes to white folk, you stupid turd. Jeez, you cannot parse a simple sentence without tripping all over yourself. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 252 of 377 ) gandalf: " It happend in Kargil, its happening today." Since when did the US holding back pakistan on its own become "mediation"? you ignorant moron. The US took it upon itself to ask pakistan to pull back (pakistan was denying that its troops had taken over Indian territory in Kargil at that point), and while it worked in India's favor, there was no new agreement between India and Pak with US assistance (which would be necessary for it to become third-party mediation) You are clearly too stupid for strategic thought. Dont just spout some crap about India accepting third party mediation. Go check out what happened all the times India did exactly that, and what happened next. You might be a cretin who does not know history and wants to repeat it, but luckily for Indians, the Indian govt. knows the history of the situation and is shaping the best strategic options available. |
|
ryounger 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 253 of 377 ) Karapal--Again you are correct on the history but so was I. I am agreeing with you that India can solve the problem but has been unable to for whatever reason. Not faulting anyone but facts are facts. Not everyone thinks sliding up to Pakistan is a smart thing in this country. We debate that here on a daily basis, on the other hand what are the solutions? I am no oracle at all but what are the solutions Indians have? I see war mongers-- and in this case I think they may right. On the other hand the risks are high on both sides. Personally I don't know how most Indians can stomach their people being killed and not doing anything about it. And how the international community (not just the US) can ask for "calmer heads to prevail". Yes the problem is complex on most levels but the bottom line is simple, is Kashmir part of India or not? If true defend it. And tell the international community that is the way it is. But pick a direction and stick to it. I think most Americans will respect that. (Not that it matters). And the president would have to at least pay lip service to it since that is exactly what America has done. You kill our people we come looking for you, no matter where you are. This might not be right or just all the time but that is a direction we have and will follow. That is all I am saying to you about India. Pick a direction and lead. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 254 of 377 ) ryounger: "Yes the problem is complex on most levels but the bottom line is simple, is Kashmir part of India or not? If true defend it. And tell the international community that is the way it is. But pick a direction and stick to it. I think most Americans will respect that." I agree with your perspective. I think India's problem is internal. We have a significant fraction of third-rate "intellectuals" who talk of making peace with terrorists because that is the "moral" way. This is particularly true of the Indian leftists and communists. Kashmir was acceded to India with the same set of documents as all other Indian states. India's leaders like Nehru and Gandhi were too immmature to handle the problem back then and made the mistake of taking it to the UN. The British used that oppurtunity to screw India over on Kashmir, and things have never come back to normal since then. I think India is on the right path this time; only the destruction of the paki army will make that region peaceful -- the paki army has been feeding its people hateful propaganda for the past two decades and they are not about to stop anytime. |
|
ulmo3 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 255 of 377 ) Do we need war with Pakistan? Yes terrorism has been bleeding us for the last 20 odd years but take a look at what it has done to Pakistan. In 1984 when they were actively promoting terrorism in Punjab Pakistan had a GDP higher than India, their Industries were doing well and their economy was pretty solid. I dont have to tell you guys where they are now. The point is we are winning this war. Its been a war which is fought not only with guns but also with money. This is similar to what the US did to the Soviet Union. Made them spend and spend on armaments and bankrupted them. That is what is happening in Pakistan inspite doses of money and handouts from the US. Now lets the take the scenario if we go for a full fledged war with Pakistan. When the push comes to the shove they will use the Nukes, and get wiped out why? because they have nothing to loose, they are a failed state, a county without a future. We will win the war but the costs will be higher than what we are paying now. Since Pakistan is right next to us, radioactivity can spread to India. We will win the war but loose our future. We are a country with a future , we have done pretty well in the last 50 years inspite of corruption and other things. A nuclear war will finish our future too. But a low intensity war fought defensively though bleeding us bleeds Pakistan more and more. In the end they will be dependent on Western dole and the West right now doesnt want South Asia Unstable why?? Not because they are our friends but because they want to make money , from our markets. So India is doing the right things, threatening, cajoling , blackmailing the other countries into putting pressure on Pakistan . Increasing defence spending hoping Pakistan will try to match it and win the war over a period of time. Remember Punjab it took 15 years to put down terrorism without attacking Pakistan, same thing will happen in Kashmir too , may take a little longer because of Foreign Mercenaries but it will happen |
|
ulmo3 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 256 of 377 ) Karapall Let me put it this way , Kashmir should be a part of India, not for any sentimental reasons but because India cannot afford to have Kashmir taken away. Over the last 50 years there have been so many seperatist pressures inside India. We have the North East for the last 50 years, in the 60s Dravidian movement, in the 80s Punjab, 90s Kashmir. Over a period of time these seperatist movements have reduced from demanding Independent Nations to seperates States, Jharkand, Ghorka Land, Uttaranchal etc. The only reason is that they all know that India would never agree for seperation. If India even agrees to let Kashmir out all these seperatist movements will erupt again. So India cannot afford to loose Kashmir at any cost The point of whether it is right or wrong does not come into the picture. What is right for one man is wrong for another. That is how it is among Nations. The point is do we need Kashmir yes we do , there fore we need to defend it and keep it within India. How do we do that? I guess we disagree in that. You advocate open war with Pakistan I think the cost of it is prohibitive. About Mediation and talks I think I agree with you. Since we are not willing to budge from our position that Kashmir is an Integral Part of India any mediation is counter productive. Milatancy in Kashmir will finally fizzle out like it did in Punjab, Nagaland, Assam etc after there is strong milatary action and people living there get fed up with violence. Look at the latest poll among Kashmiris. most of them prefer India to Pakistan. Ofcourse the poll didnt give them an option of Independence. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 257 of 377 ) ulmo3, Yes, I agree. Sentimentality and morality have nothing to do with national security. Also, the goal is to break up the terror infrastrcture in pakistan, and war is one means of achieving that goal, but I think coercion and diplomacy must be used to the hilt first. Winning without fighting a war is the best way, if possible. I think the current govt. has got it all figured out, and I see an end in sight for the kashmir problem once musharraf is assassinated/overthrown and pakistan gets into more chaos than it is today. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 258 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Karapall : I see an end in sight for the kashmir problem once musharraf is assassinated/overthrown and pakistan gets into more chaos than it is today. What wonderful logic. Atleast the US is able to control Mushman for us. When the state goes into the hands of fanatics we will have another Afghanistan on our borders and planes falling over our parliament and installations. It is in India's interest if some form of weak leadership exists in Pakistan so that we can control them by coercion or by international pressure. I wonder if you eat too much beef. Surely the mad cow has gotten to your head. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 259 of 377 ) jbindra: "Atleast the US is able to control Mushman for us. " The US is now forced to control mushman because India has threatened to screw their "war on terrorism" if the US thinks it can wink at kashmiri terrorism just to please mushy. " When the state goes into the hands of fanatics we will have another Afghanistan on our borders and planes falling over our parliament and installations." Right now, everyone prefers India to get screwed because pakistan is exclusively an Indian problem. India should just make sure that pakistan becomes everybody's problem. No, if Mushy goes, pakistan becomes the world's problem, and I can bet that their nukes will be taken out in no time at all. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 260 of 377 ) jbindra: "It is in India's interest if some form of weak leadership exists in Pakistan so that we can control them by coercion or by international pressure." "weak leadership"??!!! Pakistan has always been led by the bastards in the paki army, who are mainly responsible for killing so many Indians via terrorism. If you really want to understand the level of insanity in the pakistani army, try reading www.defencejournal.com. The guys in the paki army are a bunch of psychopaths whose only goal is to get revenge on India for being humiliated in the 1971 war. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 261 of 377 ) jbindra, Every country is out for its own interests, as is India. You seem to think that the US has any power to tell India what to do. it does not!! Of course, they will use diplomatic coercion and moral arguments to get India to back off from protecting its own interests, but the current crop of leaders in India know fully well that it is all realpolitik. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 262 of 377 ) jbindra, you are a cocksucking india hating asshole. a "gaddar". bastard, i have not seen one "bad" word for your "loving" pakistan in your postings. motherfucking khalistani bastard, the islamic assholes will reem your stinking ass if they get hold of you. matherchot, how long will khalistan last do you think retard. the "punjabi" muslims will bugger you in your mouth you dickhead. fucking bastard, all your postings are personal. why don't you give us a solution to the kashmir and pakistan problems. what is your take on it. you say war is not the answer. asshole what is it then. care to let us know. |
|
luvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 263 of 377 ) jbindra, you are a cocksucking india hating asshole. a "gaddar". bastard, i have not seen one "bad" word for your "loving" pakistan in your postings. motherfucking khalistani bastard, the islamic assholes will reem your stinking ass if they get hold of you. matherchot, how long will khalistan last do you think retard. the "punjabi" muslims will bugger you in your mouth you dickhead. fucking bastard, all your postings are personal. why don't you give us a solution to the kashmir and pakistan problems. what is your take on it. you say war is not the answer. asshole what is it then. care to let us know. |
|
ulmo3 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 264 of 377 ) Karapall : I see an end in sight for the kashmir problem once musharraf is assassinated/overthrown and pakistan gets into more chaos than it is today. Is that going to stop terrorist attacks on India. Yes India has the option of going to war which even more risky with Nuclear weapons. Ok Lets assume for arguments sake we go to war and they dont use Nuclear weapons and we win the war. Well what then are we going to occupy Pakistan? More trouble because the terrorist will become our citizens. Ok so are we going dismantle Pakistans army, navy , airforce. How is it going to stop a fruit cake from strapping a bomb and blowing himself up. Are we going to kill every Pakistani (ethnic cleansing), would solve terrorism if there was no one around only we will become and international Pariah and we cant afford to let that happen. Gives the excuse to all western nations to interfere in our affairs again. So how does winning the war killing a few thousand Pakistanis solve anything except salvage our ego as Macho RAMBOS american ehstyle :) Actually Fencing the border would have been viable if not for the terrain. What Kashmir needs is not a weak chaotic Pakistan where the Pakistanis have nothing to loose but a Pakistan where the Pakistanis have everything to loose. How many of these terrorist would resort to terrorism martyring themselves if they had a job a secure future? Quite a few nutcases I am sure, but not as much as they have now. They wont have the critical mass to foment terror. A Pakistan descending into Chaos and the Nuclear weapons falling into the hands of Islamic crack pots is our worst nightmare Musharaff, is a crook and cannot be trusted but he can be trusted not to commit suicide. Sure he will send people to do it for him, he personally loves his life. WHich is why he still Indias best bet. Oh Bindra as for US helping us , its only if it suits them. Thats true for every nation including India. A nation has no friends only Interests. And the best way we can make it suit US, is get their industries to invest. Man these guys love their money and will go to any lenghts to protect it. Take a look at whats happening in Afghanistan. Its not about terror its about a gas pipeline |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 265 of 377 ) ulmo3: "Well what then are we going to occupy Pakistan? More trouble because the terrorist will become our citizens." No, keep your eye on the prize, which is a complete elimination of the terror infrastructure within pakistan, without which the islamic jihadi terrorists wont last a week. Of course, if this happens, you can be sure that pakistan will fragment into smaller pieces, but as long as these jihadi vermin stay on the other side of the fence, India should not have a problem with it. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 266 of 377 ) ulmo3: "How is it going to stop a fruit cake from strapping a bomb and blowing himself up." If you want a solution that handles all unforeseeable events, then you are in for a disappointment. In the real world, governments have to operate under multiple constraints and determine what their goals are in order of priority. Right now, the priority is to end this kashmir problem with pakistan once and for all. Towards that end, India needs to evaluate its course of action based on ground realities and not based on some fantastic scenarios AFTER the kashmir problem is solved. These jihadi vermin dont just hate Indians, they also hate pretty much everyone else who is not a muslim. So, if you think that India is the only country which will be affected after the paki army is torn down , you are mistaken. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 267 of 377 ) We shall overcome. luvvman : , i have not seen one "bad" word for your "loving" pakistan in your postings Hello There. Well when you say things like this I wonder what kind of an inane moronic creature you must be. How can my patriotism be based on abusing people of a certain nation or religion ? I care for India and it's development. Not for some petty idealogy that has been injected into your brain by peverts. But what is the use of talking to an idiot like you? Explaining something to you is just like trying to give a fish a bath. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 268 of 377 ) We shall overcome. luvvman : why don't you give us a solution to the kashmir and pakistan problems Well one last time I shall reiterate what I have been saying all along. Kashmir - Let the Kashmiris decide and all; India and Pakistan abide by their decision, be it acession to a nation or independence or autonomic governance like Hong Kong in China. As far is terrorism is concerned, it is bad and the only way to end it is to provide economic stability and opportunities to youth so that they do net get led astray in desperation. Simultaneoulsy we must be in a defensive role in Kashmir wrt terrorismt than an offensive one as we need the confidence of the people if we want Kashmir to stay with us. Pakistan - We must engage it in dialogue, diplomacy and on the border simultaneoulsy. They must learn that we are well meaning but fools to be taken for a ride. Threatening them will make no sense. Once they get their economy and democratic system working and overhauled, people will realise what is important -- money and a decent life. Then, I am sure India and Pakistan will become leaders of the SAARC and perhaps lay the foundation for a confedrate South Asian state like the EU. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 269 of 377 ) jbindra: "Kashmir - Let the Kashmiris decide and all; India and Pakistan abide by their decision, be it acession to a nation or independence or autonomic governance like Hong Kong in China." Firstly, you should go read the instrument of accession of Kashmir to India, and understand that if you claim that kashmir is not a legitimate Indian state, then the legitimacy of all Indian states in question. But let us look past this for a second, and probe your "solution" to the paki problem. I see... and if kashmir becomes an independent country, how do you India can keep it from falling into the hands of jihadi terrorists, especially when the Indian army is no longer in control?? What if pakistan takes virtual control of that territory like they did in Afghanisthan?? Will that solve any of India''s current headaches or increase it? Dumb shits like you should think things through a little more instead of regurgigating ignorant and uninformed bullshit that you read in the western press. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 270 of 377 ) jbindra: "As far is terrorism is concerned, it is bad and the only way to end it is to provide economic stability and opportunities to youth so that they do net get led astray in desperation." Mohammed atta was a well-to-do muslim with no dearth of oppurtunities and access to money, but he chose to drive a plane in the World Trade Center. So cut this crap about how poverty and deprivation pushes people to terror -- it does not. What pushes people to terror is their ideology, not their bank balance. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 271 of 377 ) Nice Sanghi line of thought about making Pakistan a World Problem. IT shows the 0 value for life that SANGHis have.. its OK if a disintergrating Pakistan uses its madmen to kill a Indians because the ens justifies the cost. Great |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 272 of 377 ) Karapall Post 270: "So cut this crap about how poverty and deprivation pushes people to terror -- it does not. What pushes people to terror is their ideology, not their bank balance" Fool. You are right that the actual 'bomber' may or may not have money but almost all strugles involve subjugated people. Bin Laden was rich, but he percieved that he was fighting for the millions of opperessed Arabs ruled by Dictator Govts. LTTE fights for a homeland, because it percieves its people livinig in economically deprived conditions under the Sinhalese. Look at you. You sit in US.. India does not give a damn about u BUT, you have this percieved feeling that some people are persecuted in Inda. THis makes you commit terrorist acts like pissing in front of mosques, Scratching 'Death to Muslims" in the elevator. So the two main causes are ' perceived extent of persecution' and "level of mental health/maturity' |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 273 of 377 ) gandalf: "You are right that the actual 'bomber' may or may not have money but almost all strugles involve subjugated people" Mohammed atta was from a well to do saudi family and he commited terrorist acts. This counter-example is sufficient to rubbish claims by stupid turds like you about how terrorists are actually nice people who like to kill others because they have nothing better to do. Well, we all have something better to do, which is to wipe these terrorist scum off the face of this earth. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 274 of 377 ) Gandalf: "You sit in US.. India does not give a damn about u BUT, you have this percieved feeling that some people are persecuted in Inda. " I live in India, while you are an american citizen who runs a sweatshop in India, by your own admission. So cut this sanctimonious bullshit. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 275 of 377 ) gandalf: "Nice Sanghi line of thought about making Pakistan a World Problem. IT shows the 0 value for life that SANGHis have" Clearly, people who want to neutralize pakis value Indian lives more than you do. You seem to think that Indians should ALWAYS face the brunt of paki terror, while the rest of the world eggs and pakistan on, as it has been for the past few decades. The question is: Given that you are more interested (by your own admission) in protecting your bank balance and business than you are worried about the Indian citizens and soldiers who die on a daily basis, why is a NRI SOB like you coming out and pretending to be a patriot?? Since when did patriots condone the death and slaughter of their fellow citizens. You dont care, because you are an american NRI asshole who has an agenda different from that most Indians, who just dont want to get blown up on the way to work or school. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 276 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Karapall : According to you: gandalf = profiteering NRI subscribing to the "economic man" ideal anwarsad = jehadi muslim wolf in the clothing of a moderate muslim saurabhs = liberal hindu who has a slavish/defeatist mentality fayaz = Koran reading jihadi who justifies killing of everyone except muslims ulmo3 = another liberal hindu who betrays his brotherhood luwman,the truth and mumbai02 = your brothers and partners in crime jbindra = khalistani turd who's set his clock perpetually to 12 HRS |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 277 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Karapall : Care to tell us how you would characterise yourself ? |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 278 of 377 ) jbindra, nice try, you khalisthani fart. I have nothing against saurabhs and ulmo3 and mumbai, because they are eminently sensible people with their heads squarely on their shoulders. Also, luwmann and mumbai2 go a little overboard on their rhetoric, but at least they have the honesty to say what they feel, unlike you and your devious jihadi and communist buddies. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 279 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Karapall : So according to you if I dont have a Hindu name or if I dont abuse Muslims and refrain from praising the VHP and BD, I lack the honesty to say what I feel and am jehadi and a communist. Wonderful logic from a man who seems to be totally devoid of it. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 280 of 377 ) jbindra: "So according to you if I dont have a Hindu name or if I dont abuse Muslims and refrain from praising the VHP and BD, I lack the honesty to say what I feel and am jehadi and a communist." No, according to me, if you are an ignorant moron who does not know the first thing about the ground realities, and you try to piss on Indians for not kowtowing to the jihadi agenda, such as "liberating" kashmir or liberating punjab OR insisting that India must not nuke pakistan in retaliation if pakistan nukes India, then you are a jihadi and a communist motherfucker, who thinks that a swear-word-free post riddled with inaccuracies and lies is equivalent to an intellectually honest post. |
|
jbindra 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 281 of 377 ) We shall overcome. Karapall : A wonderful try. Now who do you think will believe you other than Luvvman or Mumbai02 who are you with different aliases ? Ignorant and moron are words that seem like your middle and last name my friend, so dont obviate your filial ascendancy to us. Got it Mr. Karapall Ignorant Moron ? |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 282 of 377 ) All said and done, this fool karapall can be funny. I am now an NRI :-).. What a buffon!!!.. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 283 of 377 ) jbindra: "so dont obviate your filial ascendancy to us" Are you some sort of artificial intelligence program that picks random words from the dictionary and makes faux-sentences out of them? That could also explain the complete boneheadedness of the contents of the message, even when the grammar was perfect. |
|
Iuvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 284 of 377 ) to all : please note we all are indian first we shall not have hatred against each other. ok agreed we might have different perspectives but it doesn't look nice to abuse each other, we are discussing here the third party mediation to solve the kashmir crisis isn't it ? |
|
Iuvvmann 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 285 of 377 ) to all : please note we all are indian first we shall not have hatred against each other. ok agreed we might have different perspectives but it doesn't look nice to abuse each other, we are discussing here the third party mediation to solve the kashmir crisis isn't it ? |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 286 of 377 ) This is the fake Lowman (rambakth02@yahoo).. dear fake turd.. why is your ID ram Bakth.. Why are you also using the same cowardly hypocritical techniques as you RSS brothers.. Though I am sure they will disown you, Or are you Lowmans girl or boy friend. Ahh.. you must be Gay lowmans little boy.. Hello little pinky |
|
TuSoSa 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 287 of 377 ) Michael Kreppon's argument does not take into consideration what are the real facts behind this problems and why the diplomacies are failing time & again. Only India & pakistan themeselves can find solution to the problem and anyoutside help to this matter is actually complicating the problem . Please remember India & Pakistan had been one country known in history as Bharat ,for many years before 1947 .Why the separation took place at ll , was it the solution for the Hindu- Muslim problem that time ? Time has proved , it was a wrong solution. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 288 of 377 ) TuSoSa: "Michael Kreppon's argument does not take into consideration what are the real facts behind this problems and why the diplomacies are failing time & again." Michael Krepon is an anti-India motherfucker who needs an aluminium pole up his ass. This motherfucker has been continuously writing against India and Indian interests for the past many years. This motherfucker Michael Krepon supported the imposition of sanctions on India after pokharan. My question is: why do we even bother to consider opinion of such white assholes who clearly have their own anti-India agenda up their sleeve. If you guys meet this motherfucker anywhere in India, put your boot up this motherfuckers's ass. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 289 of 377 ) For example, I challenge forumites to find one statement by this asshole Michael Krepon that explicitly links pakistan with terrorism in India. This bastard and the rest of his intellectually inbred cousins in the US state dept. have always been anti-India and pro-Pakistan and remain so to this day. |
|
BK 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 290 of 377 ) No to third part mediation. if at all third party mediation is required only country qualify to take this role is Israel. |
|
BK 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 291 of 377 ) No to third part mediation. if at all third party mediation is required only country qualify to take this role is Israel. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 292 of 377 ) Thats new BK, care to explain? |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 293 of 377 ) BK: "No to third part mediation. if at all third party mediation is required only country qualify to take this role is Israel." That is a strange attitude. It certainly does not help India to give another reason to these islamic jihadi turds to create more mayhem in India, especially given that these islamic animals have an agenda to wipe the jews from middle east completely and thoroughly (that the jews are smarter and can handle these barbarians is a different matter). |
|
BK 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 294 of 377 ) I through Isarel's name just to test the reaction of Jehadis only; because I know that will not be acceptable to Jehadis and so called secularist. I do believe that there should be no third party mediation. |
|
sanxena 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 295 of 377 ) When two parties cannot solve the problem on their own and if that problem affects other parties also, then a third party mediation cannot be ruled out for very long. With Kashmir in international eyes, India cannot escape a third party mediation. I think putting trust on USA will not be a bad idea because any other country as a mediator will not be that effective. |
|
BK 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 296 of 377 ) Well USA is invlolved with Israel and Palestine as third party mediator for years what is the result? Looking at USA for solving our problems is very sad. You need to kep one thing in mind that USA believes in capitalism meaning evrything has got price tag and every one is a consumer.USA will see her interest first. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 297 of 377 ) Then get Norway to mediate.. the worst you have to pay is agreeing to import Norweigian sardines |
|
BK 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 298 of 377 ) Norway is getting some sucess between Srilanka and Tamil because none of the party is Islamic. When one party is Islamic you are hitting your head on wall. Our way is the only way thats their philosophy. India is capable of solveing its own problem we do not need third party mediation. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 299 of 377 ) If so BK, why havent we solved it. Why are we so scared of others.. souds a bit like the licence raj days when Rahul Bajaj used to say 'India is capable of building her vehicles".. True, but as always this noble sentiment is usurped by a few for their ends. I support 3rd part mediation. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 300 of 377 ) sanxena: "When two parties cannot solve the problem on their own and if that problem affects other parties also, then a third party mediation cannot be ruled out for very long." And did you just happen to pull this theory out of your nether orifice?? Or do you have substantive facts to back up your claim?? You can start by explaining how the India-pak affair "affects third parties". Think carefully before you reply. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 301 of 377 ) Gandalf: "Then get Norway to mediate.. the worst you have to pay is agreeing to import Norweigian sardines" You sound like those cretins we read about in the history texts who thought they could use the british to screw their Indian adversaries, and in the end the brits screwed them all. If you dont know your history, you are doomed to repeat your past mistakes. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 302 of 377 ) Gandalf: "Why are we so scared of others" Clearly your IQ is not all that high, so I will explain. It is not a point of being "scared", as this is not a game of being macho. The point is that "others" have their own agenda in the region. When you hear the words "power projection by country X", it is an euphemism for installing military bases of country X in your country and in your neighbourhood. So that you can be coerced into behaving as country X asks you to. For example, you ask some country to be involved in what is essentially an internal problem. Now, this country's motives and interests in "helping you" will usually have NOTHING TO DO with you or your problem. Go read about how the US and European countries "helped" solve problems in weaker developing countries by essentially installing a pliable dictator in the country, thereby having easy access to all the natural resources in that country. Things are not as trivially simple as you make it out to be, and you would know that if you actually educated yourself before opening your stupid mouth. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 303 of 377 ) An apt analogy would be story of the monkey and the two cats by Aesop: Two cats have a cake that they want to divide but they cannot achieve a consensus among themselves, so they invite a monkey to help them. The monkey "helps" them by breaking the cake into two. Unfortunately, one piece is larger than the other, so the monkeys eats part of the larger portion so that the two "halves" would be "identical". In the end, the cats got the crumbs from their own cake while the monkey walked out with a full stomach. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 304 of 377 ) In the case of kashmir, any third party that can establish a base there will be placed conveniently to create trouble for Russia, China, and India, not to mention all of the central asia. The world is all about land and resources, and it always has been. India's biggest problems have been pseudo-intellectual cretins who are not only ignorant of history and reality, but who have a constant need to moralize instead of taking the side of their own country and furthering the interests of their countrymen and their country. This also means that there are issues where Gandalf would have to speak in one voice along with the VHP or other groups he does not care about. If he chooses to hold hands with the norwegians to screw Indians he does not like, we are in for another round of being dominated by non Indians within our own country. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 305 of 377 ) Karapall, Clearly your IQ is abysmal. Where did you think that I expect India to have a free lunch. Only buffons like you would expect the same.. same mistake you are making with you Sanghi support. We have a problem, we have a cost to the problems. We have to see the cost of the solution and decided if its worth it. Dont get all emotional about US and Europe. I am sure that Germany had to pay for the Marshall plan. But I am aslo sure that bno one would have complaints about the same. You are a dolt |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 306 of 377 ) Gandalf: "We have a problem, we have a cost to the problems. We have to see the cost of the solution and decided if its worth it. " CAre to get a little more specific, or are you afraid of being exposed yet again as a vacuous fart who has no clue as to the exact nature of our relationship with powerful countries should be. Clearly, to make such a call one has to understand how these "south asian experts" in these powerful countries think. Stephen Cohen who is a prime pro-pakistani cocksucker and an absolutely dishonest motherfucker comes to India and tells Indians that they should be handing pakisan to kashmir, and CRETINS like gandalf want some third party to come and solve India's problems for a "price". This is not a plumbing job for get a problem solved for a price, you brainless shit. There are certain things like national sovereignity that cannot be compromised, because once that is done it is an invitation to every busybody on the planet to interfere with India's affairs. |
|
BK 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 307 of 377 ) Only solution to Kashmir solution is drive out terrorist culture and get back to our culture. Subcontinent will experience peace and progress once barbric cultrue is rejected by all misgudied people. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 308 of 377 ) How about driving out American culture too.. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 309 of 377 ) Gandalf: "How about driving american culture too". Sounds like a good idea. |
|
BK 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 310 of 377 ) Sounds like good idea to me too. |
|
Sameer28 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 311 of 377 ) BK, Isn't it time for you to say something else!! Is this the culture you want to give us? Based on caste, rape the lower caste women, use seperate wells for drinking water, give low caste women to temple as devdasis, Only Higher caste hindoos can get educated!! Strip the woman in public to take revenge!(watch Mahabarath) Kill 20000 people and say it was just 'fair retaliation'! raping of women, attacking the people under the guise of riots, slitting open the womb of pregnant woman, Taking yatras to convince people the best thing to happen to India is gujurat riots. ..and now like Mr.Advani you wouldn't blame the Pakis for all your problems, would you? |
|
BK 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 312 of 377 ) Sameer No I woud't blame Pakistan for these problems. These problems are there and we must addressed them. Please note this are not large scale problems. Caste system is always used to attack Hinduism. Today its not as much problem as it used to be 50 years back. These problems can be solved through education. When you read or watch Mahabharat or Ramayan why you want to read only stripping of woman? Why don't you see respect given to Sita? That is why I keep telling that we need to know our own culture first. We know for the fact that Islam is giving us nothing but problems can you deny this? What you are suggesting is that since we have our own problems having problems from foreign culture is welcome? Many of the problems you have mentioned are not part of original Vedic culture. What you are suggesting here Islam is better for India? Vedic culture is not good? I am sure many problems will be solved if people give up foreign culture. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 313 of 377 ) http://www.rediff.com/news/2002/oct/08spec.htm Here is a laundry list of the atrocities committed by pakistanis on Indian citizens. If an Indian reads this and still has sympathies for pakis, then that "indian" better move to pakistan. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 314 of 377 ) I guess a lot of people are shitting in their pants and calling the movers now that Krappy has spoken... |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 315 of 377 ) gandalf, my dear brother in islam, I hope you will render your services to help any of these fine souls in their moving, since they will too busy laundering their pants. I know I can always depend on you, my dear brother in islam. |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 316 of 377 ) Sameer 28, Salaam Alyekum, my brother. Outstanding post, my brother, #312. You are a true faithful destined to go to paradise straight. Just as a fly is attracted by putrid shit you dove straight to the Stripping of Draupadi. Bravo, bravo. Honorary citizenship of Pakistan is all yours! Bravo, my brother, bravo.Pure faithfuls in that most glorious of lands, killed, converted or drove out all the filthy idolaters. Bravo, bravo. May you get the honor of stripping Arundhati in Public.Bravo, bravo. |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 317 of 377 ) Sameer28, Salaam Alyekum my brother. Great news. The latest Time magazine says that Bangla Desh is now becoming the hotbed of Al Qaeda terrorist activity directed at the Indian North East. It says that the harkat-al-jihad-al-Islam(HUJI) was strenthened by the arrival of new fighters from Afghsnistan. Even happier is the news that the Bangla Deshi secret service, DGFI is coordinating with the Pakistanbi ISI terrorist activities in Assam carried out under the name of United Liberation Front Of Assam (ULFA) How lovely. We imported terrorism in Kashmir and now in Assam, just per our Grand Design.See, how useful we 120 million faithfuls are, we will scream for secularism and at the same time carry out our plan . We will subvert from within while talking about our patriotism and constitutional rights. We will support the Congressi hijdas, act as vote banks. Get the Congress elected. Work to ban the RSS, the VHP, the Shiv Sena. We will weaken all the Nationalist organizations from within and when the great moment comes join with our Pakistani and Bangla Deshi brothers to liberate this land under Sharia Laws. BRAVO. BRAVO! We will send the idolaters to hell even before they die . Great, just great. See how Fakruddin Ali ahmed helped the cause by encouraging and managing infiltration from Bangla Desh. And these Congressi assholes made him the President! Victory is ours. Vote for Sonia.Root for Shekhar Gupta, Arundhati, Prem Shankar Za et al. Weaken the country.Then when the timing is right we will fix the Americam bastards. Meanwhile we will reproduce and reproduce! Wow! The whole world will submit to the will of Allah.Oh, just great! Praise be to Allah. |
|
papu 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 318 of 377 ) Hallo Mr sin and bad, try to enter China, your ball will get burned and your prophet and Allah can only watch and cry. Where is the will of Allah Mr sinbad the real idol worshiper? Your prophet is waiting for you in the hell fire for worshiping idol?! Do you know that the Muslims are the real idol worshipers? |
|
papu 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 319 of 377 ) Sin and bad, you want to strip Droupaty, good; you want to strip Arunthathy, very good. Strip your mother very-very good. Strip Kadijah and Muhamad, oh what a thrill!? |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 320 of 377 ) sinbad: "May you get the honor of stripping Arundhati in Public.Bravo, bravo." Just like arundhati who claims that islamic jihadi terrorism is because muslims are having their backs to the wall --- she gives an excuse for islamic terrorism. This time around, we can all stand by while arundhati is being stripped and blame all the sexual tension in men that needs a release valve such as A. Roy's stripping an beating. Yes, that sounds as convincing as Roy's arguments. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 321 of 377 ) Pseudo"intellectuals" like A. Roy, the avowed anti-India MF Prem Shanker Jha, and Vinod Mehta seem to think that appeasing islamic terrorists will bring them over to their side. I think hindus have committed the mistake of appeasement once before under the stewardship of the Mohandas "Let us all wear khadi and live in the toilet" Gandhi. |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 322 of 377 ) Papuji, Salaam Alyekum, I read your post with deep pain in my heart. Pls try to understand. We , the faithfuls in India, are not known for bravery or courage, as we have descended from those who were converted by force or by bribery. Only Karapall and I have been won over by the humanistic appeal of Islam.I have tried to highlight the same repeatedly.We need more adherents but strong men like brother Satnam and you, not pathetic weaklings like GAndalf Khanji. So pls reconsider your position, my potential brother in Islam. Pls also enlighten me as to how you call us believers as idol-worshippers.IDOL WORSHIPPING IS THE WORST SIN A MAN MAY COMMIT.Allah, the compassionate,Allah the merciful, forgives all sins but idolatry and disbelief in his word as revealed to Mohammed(PBUH), the last prophet(PBUH) We are required to destroy idolaters and make the entire world submit to the will of Allah, the merciful and compassionate by whatever means. Since we cannot win an all-out war we must resort to trickery ,cunning and betrayal. |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 323 of 377 ) Papuji, Pls read 2:190-2:194 of our glorious Koran.It says: Idolatry is worse than carnage. Kill them whereever you find them........Fight against them till idolatry is no more. Talking about trickery, see how well-versed Anwarsadji is in trickery. He talks with glee about the defeat of the Marathas at the hand of the Gazi Ahmadshah Abdali in Panipat in 1761. See, he cleverly omitted that the so-called Mogul Emperor, who was nothing more than a servant of the Marathas at that time, withheld supplies to the Marathas at the crucial time, so that the Marathas were starving when they went out to war and lost only by a whisker. Glory be to the Mogul Emperor,whatever the motherfucker's name be, for his great act in support of the true faith. Anwarsadji also omitted, very cleverly, to tell us that Peshve Madhavrao avenged Panipat by driving the Durranis back into Afghanistan. It is lucky that Madhvrao died at age of 27, otherwisw what havoc he would have caused. Madhavrao also kicked the living daylights out of the Nizam of Hyderabad and beat up that innocent faithful Tipu Sultan whose only crime was that he was spreading the true faith by sword. Fortunately, a faithful Hakim poisoned Madhavrao. See how Allah helps the faithfuls. May Allah be praised. (The source for above is Grant Duff'd History of the Marathas.) |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 324 of 377 ) Karapallji, Salaam Alyekum, See how smart brother Prem Khan Zhaduwala is.He is suggesting that those who are imprisoned under minor charges under POTA in J&K must be released forthwith. Obviously, now POTA will apply to serious offenses like Nationalism! Terrorism is not a cognizable offence,bravo, Prem Khan,bravo. |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 325 of 377 ) Beeji, The Grand Imam of this MB, Salaam Alyekum, Will you kindly explain to me the purpose of the "boys with eternal youth, who to the beholders' eyes will seem like sprinled pearls" as in 76:15 to 76:28. Many a nasty on this MB is describing that as appealing to pedophilia.They will burn in hell. Praise be to Allah. |
|
BK 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 326 of 377 ) "Anwarsadji also omitted, very cleverly, to tell us that Peshve Madhavrao avenged..." This is quite unfair. Indians can not be blamed for lack of knowledge of Indian history. Cause if you look at history books in school our history starts with golden time of Mugals and ends with independence with the help of Muslims. |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 327 of 377 ) BKJee, Salaam Alyekum, My intention was not to write about Indian History, which fortunately has been greenwashed by the Father of The Grand Design, the Great Maulana Abul Kalam Azad. The Grand Design, of course, is to bring Unified India under the Laws Of Allah, the merciful, Allah, the compassionate. My intention was to expose the dastardly behavior of the Maratha Marauders. I should tell you that in 1710 or thereabouts the Mugal Emperor eradicated a couple of Hindu temples.May Allah bless him. Do you know that Peshve Bajirao, within four weeks upon hearing the news, had camped outside Delhi, had the temerity of summoning the emperor and had the temples rebuilt. What outrage! (continued) |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 328 of 377 ) (continuing) And then this wretched Bajirao proceeded to keep his dastardly General,one Ranoji Shinde in Gwalior permanently to keep a watch on the Emperor! What villiany. Gandalf Khanji is absolutely right about Brahmins, this Bajirao, the handsome devil,was a brahmin. Oh, Allah, pls have mercy! This Bajirao and his sword! Allah save us. This brahmin literally fucked us faithfuls, he will burn in hell forever. His love affair with Mastani is well known. fortunately, we faithfuls have ensured that the idolaters do not talk or write about Peshve Bajirao or Peshve Madhavrao. Thanks are due to those traitors, to their kind of course, Gandhi and Nehru. We make serials on Tipu Sultan instead. The brave Gazi, Tipu, almost singlehandedly, brought Mopla land under the true faith. He did use force but so what. May Allah be praised. |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 329 of 377 ) (continuing) The Devil himself must have given birth to this evil cast of Shivaji, Sambhaji and Tarabai and the whole wretched Bhosle clan! Cursed be the evil Rajputs. Cursed be the evil Brahmins, especially Maharashtrians. Bajirao, Madhavrao. What foolhardy courage,what recklessness! Truely evil. Same with those Sikhs.Cursed they are of Allah, especially that Govind Singh! |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 330 of 377 ) The source for above is M G Ranade's THE RISE OF THE MARATHA POWER,which that Sufi idiot Rafiq Zakaria recommends to everyone. Also refer to G S Sardesai and Jadunath Sarkar. Praise be to Allah. |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 331 of 377 ) Karapallji, Sallam Alyekum,my esteemed brother and learned friend in the Glorious Koran. Read this, read this and roll on the floor in anguish! One Uttar Pradeshi Poet, Kavi Bhushan ,shamelessly writes about that Devil incarnate Shivaji! "KASHIKI KALA JATI MATHURA KI MASJID HOTI AGAR SHIVAJI NA HOTE TO SABKI SUNNAT HOTI" What gross outrage. Now you know why we faithfuls used to throw stones at Shivaji Jayanti processions! But Alas now we are afraid of the Shiv Sena thugs. May Allah protect the faithfuls! BEEji, what shall we do what shall we do! Despair everywhere! |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 332 of 377 ) sinbad: "Now you know why we faithfuls used to throw stones at Shivaji Jayanti processions! But Alas now we are afraid of the Shiv Sena thugs. " The shive sena fascists must be destroyed if the islamiyat and the honor and dignity of the Indian muslim and the muslim-to-be's are to be protected. May the glorious one show us muslims the way to glory and heaven, as we walk upon the dead bodies of the idolators. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 333 of 377 ) sinbad: "My intention was not to write about Indian History, which fortunately has been greenwashed by the Father of The Grand Design, the Great Maulana Abul Kalam Azad. " "Greenwashing"!! I like that term, my brother. Did you read true pakistani muslim Mushirul Hasan's paeans to the father of the Indian muslim, Abul Kalam Azad, who said to Gandhi "Even a muslim criminal is a better human that you are". Such is the greatness of the muslim leaders of India as maintained by our greenwashed history textbooks. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 334 of 377 ) "THE RISE OF THE MARATHA POWER.." Yapyap.. Why dont you Ghaatis use your power to clean your asses.. Every one is sick of hearing about the village rebellion. And a fool asked "what could be more sinful than idolatory".. How about BEEF EATING????? Have a nice day pots and kettles |
|
Satnam 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 335 of 377 ) Gandu halfwit, So you humane ,secular broad-minded latrine cleaner hates Maharashtris as well! Gujratis, Rajputs, Brahmins, illiterate Surds,North Indians.Anyone left? So you only love the Pakis, right. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 336 of 377 ) Why are you so touchy :-) just because you guys get orgasms on listening to Maratha bullshit and I dont does not mean I hate you... Tut tut Oh HO HUM, Pipe down! |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 337 of 377 ) And answer my question on Beef eating |
|
Satnam 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 338 of 377 ) Gandu Shitwit, You really are the unflushable turd! Why orgasm, I am sure you cannot even get it up! Ah, that is why that corn up your bunghole! Those who want colon cancer are welcome to all the beefeating. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 339 of 377 ) gandalf: "I dont does not mean I hate you... " Says the man who wants to cause greivous harm to any sanghi he comes across. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 340 of 377 ) I dont think hindus are as anal about eating beef as Gandalf seems to claim. There are plenty of hindu sects that live on a meat diet. In a country like India, where meat is quite expensive, I dont see people eating such meat on a daily basis for economic reasons. All of this is not relevant to any real issue that the country faces. The sanghis have proven themselves to be a bunch of naive cretins when it comes to economic issues. They have no idea of what it takes to get a large-scale industrial base set up in India. Such a base is essential if we want to provide employment,not least because each employed youth is one less youth available to cause trouble in India. We have to get used to a specific percentage of the employable population staying out of the work force because they are worthless to any company that wants to run a profitable business. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 341 of 377 ) "The sanghis have proven themselves to be a bunch of naive cretins when it comes to economic issues" Care to enlighten us on what they have proved to be successful at other than polarizing this country? |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 342 of 377 ) Colon cancer?, no wonder Indians are the healthiest race around. Bull Crap to your scientific arguments. You are a religios bigot just like the Jihadis |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 343 of 377 ) NYT: American intelligence officials have concluded that Pakistan, a vital ally since last year's terrorist attacks, was a major supplier of critical equipment for North Korea's newly revealed clandestine nuclear weapons program, current and former senior American officials said today. The equipment, which may include gas centrifuges used to create weapons-grade uranium, appears to have been part of a barter deal beginning in the late 1990's in which North Korea supplied Pakistan with missiles it could use to counter India's nuclear arsenal, the officials said. "What you have here," said one official familiar with the intelligence, "is a perfect meeting of interests — the North had what the Pakistanis needed, and the Pakistanis had a way for Kim Jong Il to restart a nuclear program we had stopped." China and Russia were less prominent suppliers, officials said. |
|
Satnam 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 344 of 377 ) So now you have suddenly changed sides, you idiot! |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 345 of 377 ) Gandalf: "Care to enlighten us on what they have proved to be successful at other than polarizing this country?" Conveniently forgetting who started the polarization, eh? The Indian muslims have been steadily getting extremely communal since independence. The rise of the sangh is akin to the anti-body reaction when a virus/bacterium attacks your body. Somebody needs to take these jihadi MFs head on, and make them live in fear. That is the only way to control these vermin. Also, I believe that the hindu groups are certainly rising as a good counterweight against the jihadi assholes and the pseudo-secular MFs in the Indian media who cheer these jihadis onwards. These hindu groups are mostly non violent, unlike the muslim groups who ALWAYS start all the communal violence in India, and then the whole muslim community pays the price. It also seems that the muslim community has no intention of reining in the jihadis who claim to be the spokespersons of all muslims in India. The hindu groups are needed to keep the muslim jihadi communal shits in their place. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 346 of 377 ) Gandalf: >Colon cancer? If you ate as much beef on a daily basis as americans do, then you have a high chance of getting colon cancer. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 347 of 377 ) Gandalf: "China and Russia were less prominent suppliers, officials said. " None of this information is new at all. In fact, the US and even most Indians who keep up with the news know about this bartering between pakistan and North Korea. If you were really smart, you would first ask yourself, "why did the US choose to announce this bit of news now?". The answer is pretty clear: this is a warning to pakistan not to allow the MMA and Fazlur Rehman and other overt jihadis to take control of their nuclear weapons. (Everyone in pakistan is a jihadi MF, the "moderate" ones are just covert jihadis, the ones like mushirul Hasan) |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 348 of 377 ) http://www.rediff.com/election/2002/oct/19inter.ht m Look at the remarks made by this CPI(M) asshole. It is no wonder the CPI and other communists are anti-national traitors who will sell out India for a blow job from the chinese communist party. |
|
vikram99 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 349 of 377 ) communists, like muslims and christian missionaries, are always pan-national ideologues. They never owe allegiance or loyalty to their country. Like pure imperialists, their only aim is to expand their imperialist ideology to as many places as possible. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 350 of 377 ) The worst part is that the indian communists and marxists are considered to be foolish dipshits even by the ex-communists in China and Russia. These communist matherchots are basically fourth-rate "intellectual" types who are clueless about reality, but seem to think that they are sole gatekeepers of "civilized western behavior" in India. It is not for nothing that the comunist shitheadds like satish chandra who wrote all the history textbooks, have deliberately overplayed the role of islam in Indian history while relegating the 5000 years before islam to a couple of chapters. In fact, I have read quotes by this bastard where he claims that it is his duty to lie about history, because according to him, telling the truth would not be conducive to the secular nature of India, whatever the hell that is supposed to mean. |
|
vikram99 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 351 of 377 ) It is the communist version of 'jahliya' (the islamic term for age of darkness). Just like islamic bastards have termed every glorious civilisation before the birth of mohammad, so have the fucking communists done in connivance with the vatican missionaries. The Bible says creation took place on 18 October 4004 BCE at 9.20 AM or so and thats it. Every thing else in the world, every other civilisation shall be rewritten accordingly. This is the stupid basis on which the Aryan invasion theory, age of Vedas etc. were conjured up by marxist and missionary bastards like William Jones, Macaulay and Max Mueller. We have to believe a fuckin missionary whatever he tells us about our civilisation and culture or else ...... And it is this fucking intellectual imperialism (if at all there is anything 'intellectual' in it) which is pushed as 'secularism' |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 352 of 377 ) You cannot blame "intellectual imperialism" when it is acually the self-loathing nature of "liberal" Indian shitheads who would rather ignore the reality of Indian history, both good and bad parts of it, and focus on all the racist crap written by the british motherfuckers. They understood a long time back that you only need to break the Indian spirit by rewriting Indian history and speak of the muslim destroyers of Indian history in glowing terms and deliberately link all of hindu teachings to manu smiriti's worthless, racist tripe. I can tell you one thing, the enemies of hinduism have succeeded hugely, and hindus dont deserve their religion, especially since most of them think it is beneath them to actively support it. I dont care what happens to those turds either way; to the outside world I am a member of the pious christian minority (still church-going for business reasons, you see) and will be protected even if the italian whore Antonia Maino comes to power riding on a wave of tongues of the kaangress party workers that lick her asshole clean on a daily basis. If you want to see sub human, self-loathing vermin who will sell their mother to win the next election, you only need to look at the servile pieces of shit in the congress. |
|
BK 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 353 of 377 ) http://www.rediff.com/news/2002/oct/28chin.htm Read the article. Reminds me of story of two cats fighting for the bread and how monkey folled them and ate away whole bread. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 354 of 377 ) I used to wonder why Sanghis insisted on using lies and halftruths as about their only approach to propogating their way of life and social structure. I realize now that they are caught in a time wrap. The tactics that decimated Buddhism and and any other evolutionary line of thouth in India worked well in the days before mass communication. Today, there is so much information (incorrect, accurate, biased, mischievious etc) which is getting increasingly accessible to all. there are multiple channels too (print, TV, Internet). Thus people are begining to question the canards planted by the tufted donkeys. Today no-one doubts that the Godra carnage was instigated by VHP morons. But people dont have too much sympathy for some muslim tendencies to resort to violence at thedrop of a hat. But not for a moment do the general public really believe there was a Conspiracy. Sanghis/ Braminical Hindus believe they are smarter than all. Tehy think that dalits, the poor and uneducated are stupid. The fundamental rule of democracy is each person can think on his own. Hinduism among Dalits is a joke, just like Islam or Christianity is (I am referring to the politically driven brands) But they will use any religion which gives them a step above. I am least concerned about the Sanghi attack on minority religions as its a 50:50 game.. Dalits may embrace Hinduism, Islam or Christianity.. but the net result is they are going move up the ladder. The more aware they become the more they would be aware of the Machinations on our 'Indian Culture'. It would be interesting to know the outcome. Sanghis may be getting a tiger by its tail. |
|
vikram99 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 355 of 377 ) "Today no-one doubts that the Godra carnage was instigated by VHP morons." HAHAHAHAHAHA HOOOOOOO HOWWWWWWWL! JOKE OF THE YEAR! |
|
Satnam 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 356 of 377 ) Aurangzeb was instigated by VHP morons as well, so was Mahmud Gazni and Mahmmad Ghoury and all the Delhi sultans,so was Jinnah and Yahya Khan and so was WTC and so was the Moscow hostage crisis!!! Prakash Singh Badal was personally present every time instigating the VHP!!!Since he is a half breed. What is a halfbreed, you halfwitted but nasty moron? |
|
vikram99 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 357 of 377 ) Satnam, That was a good one by you. Bhagwan ne fursat se banaya ye gadhe ko! Also, VHP's forefathers instigated the genocides of the christian missionaries in Europe and American continent (north and south) where millions of humans were just wiped clean off the earth. And the inquisition in Goa, the british dominion - everything was instigated by the VHP morons. In fact, I won't be surprised if these half wits re-write history on these lines! |
|
vikram99 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 358 of 377 ) In fact, do you notice the similarity in the thinking and actions of ISI, musharaf and these communist bastards in India? All of them blame the jews and hindus for everything on earth - rain, drought, flood, terrorist attack anywhere on earth (even if in pakistan), cholera, plague, global warming, oil price, stock market crash, their dicks shrink after raping somebody, dicks do not rise.......... Everything is a jewish-hindu conspiracy! Their modus operandi is just kill and blame the victims and keep shouting loudly so that people get fed up and give up in the hope that these foul mouths just shut up! Just see any islamic jihadi, musharaf, harkishen surjeet, sitaram yechuri and their deeds and words, you will know that all of them are born out of pig semen. |
|
vikram99 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 359 of 377 ) Says Gandalf: "But people dont have too much sympathy for some muslim tendencies to resort to violence at thedrop of a hat" Fuckin shit. what the jihadis indulge in always is TERRORISM and you can't soften the crime by rechristening it as violence. Then he says "But not for a moment do the general public really believe there was a Conspiracy" I have already covered this under #358. "Sanghis/ Braminical Hindus believe they are smarter than all" Thanx for the compliment "Tehy think that dalits, the poor and uneducated are stupid" This is your inferiority complex, you turd. And we are not responsible for your screwed up thoughts and delusions. |
|
vikram99 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 360 of 377 ) "The more aware they become the more they would be aware of the Machinations on our 'Indian Culture'" All of us are aware of the machinations of the christian missionaries, the british empire and the fucking communist bastards (and whores too) in screwing up the factual history of india and the denigration of its culture in order to evangelize this 'vital continent'. "Sanghis may be getting a tiger by its tail." It should read 'Sanghis may be getting a pig by its tail' !!!! |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 361 of 377 ) "Everything is a jewish-hindu conspiracy!" Dont you wish :-), you would do anything to have some of the Isreali image to wipe of on you, wont you?. I am sure you have watched the 'raid on Entebbe' some 40 times in your shaka. 'Snigger', its that Braminical wet dream again. Jewish-Hindu conspiracy :-))) |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 362 of 377 ) It should read 'Sanghis may be getting a pig by its tail' Or to be ploitically correct, it should be catching a turnip by its tuft |
|
nikhiels 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 363 of 377 ) Woohoo!! This room is smoking!! Vikram99 seems to be a cohort of the Bajrang Dal or the RSS and still believes in castism. Man, you should be reading Rediff.com...they'd have a lot fascist articles there. You can then glow in thinking that India will be a "Hindu State" where all minorities are conspiring anarchists(that includes 350 million hindus too...ie, the Dalits). Sick fuck. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 364 of 377 ) Actually, I seem to be reacting to Vikrams tripe quite negatively. I guess this is the quinessential Sanghi trap. But its amazing how easily a perverted fring group can usurp the mantle of a religion without having the least understanding of it. Good point Nikhiel in the other thread on separation of bigots from religion and religion from the state. |
|
vikram99 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 365 of 377 ) And this nikki buddy was mouthing platitudes - 'secularism, 'equality', Jai Nehru (!!!!!). And Rediff.com articles are fascist ????? Guess it needs no more explanation on the stuff this pig's head is made up of. |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 366 of 377 ) Satnamji, May you be praised! Your suggestion regarding Nehru was perfect!One lion got rid of Gandhi, other should have fixed Nehru! |
|
sinbad 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 367 of 377 ) Vikramji, If we talk about Hinduism,Gandalf Khanji opines IT IS BORING! IT IS SILLY! IT IS OUTDATED! Now since last couple of days, Gandalf Khan is concerned about the Hindu values and teachings! Great, just great! And he loves humanity, but for the gujus, ghatis, halfbreeds (Gandalf special for Sikhs), Northies, brahmins. That leaves followers of Periyar, Mohammed and Paul! |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 368 of 377 ) Sinbudhu, dont get so upset.. halfbreed refered to you. Hail Nehru, Hail Indira, Hail Sonia, Hail the Congress and and the Marxists.. And most of all, hail the Indian media the objective ones, the anti-facists ones and the facsist ones |
|
vikram99 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 369 of 377 ) sinbad, and gandalf, the GANDU !!!!! |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 370 of 377 ) Gandalf: "And most of all, hail the Indian media the objective ones, the anti-facists ones and the facsist ones" If anyone had any doubts about this mental midget Gandalf being a pseudo-secular communist/marxist piece of human garbage, this removes all doubt. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 371 of 377 ) Gandalf: "Hail Nehru, Hail Indira, Hail Sonia, Hail the Congress and and the Marxists.." Having owed your allegiance to an ignorant italian turd called Antonia Maino, I am a little disappointed that you forgot to hail the Chinese premier and Musharraf too. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 372 of 377 ) The ignorant Italian Turd is chasing you out of every state. But of course it is only because of a sublimal mental distortion mechanism fit on all Fiat/premier padmini cars |
|
vikram99 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 373 of 377 ) "The ignorant Italian Turd is chasing you out of every state" This is another piece of pasta made of cock shit! The people in every state are chasing out BJP becoz they are becoming more and more congress like due to their following misguided secular shit! Due to Vajpayee becoming HAJpayee. People voted BJP to protect hindus, not increase haj doles to the muslims. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 374 of 377 ) Gandalf: "Today no-one doubts that the Godra carnage was instigated by VHP morons." And we are supposed to believe that this anti-hindu bigot is the vanguard of secularism in India. 300 muslims burn down 57 hindus, and this pseudo-secular, marxist shithead blames the hindus for burning themselves down, JUST TO BESMIRCH THE GOOD NAME OF GODHRA MUSLIMS, apparently. Just like muslims claim that the jews bombed the World Trade Center just to sully the names of muslims across the globe. |
|
gandalf 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 375 of 377 ) My point is it was a bunch of rabid VHP goons who provoked a bunch of illiterated brainless Godhra Muslims. Period. Bull that the ISI or any pre-planning was involved. |
|
vikram99 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 376 of 377 ) Post independence history of islamic love in Godhra: 1948: Mr. Sadva Hazi conspired an attack on District collector Shri Pimputkar in, 1948 but his bodyguard saved him at the cost of his own life. After that Mr. Sadva Hazi also left for Pakistan in 1948. On 24-3-48 one Hindu was stabbed to death near a mosque in Jahurpur area. Around 2000 houses of Hindus were burnt besides Hindu Temples. District collector Shri Pimputtkar could save the remaining areas belonging to Hindus by imposing curfew, which lasted for six months. 1965: Shops belonging to Hindus were set ablaze near Police Chowki - No. 7 by throwing incendiary material from near-by two Muslim Houses viz. Bidani & Bhopa. It could be possible because of Congress MLA belonging to minority. PSI of this Police Chowki, which was near by Railway Station, was also attacked by Muslim unsocial elements. 1980: A similar attack was made on Hindus on 29-10-80, which started from the Bus Station of Godhra. Muslim miscreants planned this attack; who were involved in anti social activities near Station Road area. Five Hindus including two children of 5 and 7-year age were burnt alive. A Gurudwara was also set on fire, in Shikari Chal of this area. Forty shops belonging to Hindus were also set on fire in station area. Due to these communal riots, Godhra was put under curfew for a year, which severely affected the Business and Industries. 1990: Four Hindu Teachers were murdered by Muslim miscreants in Saifia Madresa in Vhorvada area of Godhra on 20-11-'90. One Hindu Tailor was also stabbed to death in this area. All this was done by Muslim antisocial elements at the instance of the congress MLA of the area. 1992: More than 100 houses belonging to Hindus were set on fire near Railway Station in the year 1992 to snatch this area from Hindus. Muslim terrorists did all this. This area, now days, is lying vacant as most of the Hindu families have shifted elsewhere. 2002: Three bogies of Ahmedabad bound Sabarmati express were set on fire on 27-02-02 by Muslim miscreants. Municipal members, railway officers & employees belonging to minority community, tea stall owners, auto rickshaw drivers and Muslim antisocial elements residing nearby, had a plan to set on fire the entire train but could not do so because the train was late for four hours and they could not take the advantage of darkness of night. Following are the points for serious consideration in this incident. 1. This train was attacked near an open land belonging to Mr. Sikandar Pathan wherefrom weapons were also seized. 2. Aminabibi and her sons, who were operating gambling clubs in Godhra, attacked P.S.I. Shri Sharma with naked sword on the Railway Station in 1980. Mr. Jaspalsingh, the then Police Commissioner of Vadodara was also attacked with knife on the Railway Platform by antisocial elements operating Tea Stall on platform. 3. These antisocial Muslim elements have also attacked and injured ticket checkers about two months back. P.S.I. arrested them but the Railway Police Officer who is a Muslim, got them released. However, after a strong protest they were rearrested. This had resulted in fear of their life in Railway employees. 4. After this brutal attack on the train, Railway Police Officers took no effective rescue efforts for quite long time. Out of 30 Railway Security guards present on station, only 3 with sticks had gone to the place of attack. It is now to be considered why they had helped this way in a preplanned attack. 5. The man behind this Muslim terrorism is Pakistani Citizen Mr. Mohammed Badanga who migrated from Pakistan in 1965. He was granted Indian Citizenship at the behest of Mr. Pilu Modi the then M. P.. Mr. Badanga had promoted the ISI sponsored Terrorism which resulted in attack on the Sabarmati Express on 27-02-2002. |
|
Karapall 1/28/2002 9:05:32 PM ( 377 of 377 ) Gandalf: "My point is it was a bunch of rabid VHP goons who provoked a bunch of illiterated brainless Godhra Muslims." NOte that this is the same "secular" motherfucker who states there is no reason why the hindus in Gujarat had to kill because of the Godhra provocation. Yet, this bastard sees no problems with muslims mobs burning hindus because of "provocation" in the form of chanting ram naams in a muslim locality. Such is the blatant hypocrisy of the pseudo-secular, marxist Indian shitheads. |
bravenet.com